Replies (148)
you might want to talk to the bitcoiners funding the development of clients and the influencoors that dominate especially the primal feed about this issue.
like, you know, building other kinds of things than twitter clones.
The people who need this will figure it out.
It’s a protocol not a platform. Right now too many people view it as the latter.
Nostr es lo mejor, gente buena, honesta y amigable, además de ser bitcoiners
They don’t know about the monero bros
Bet this doesn’t help either.
View quoted note →The only active onboarding happens via bitcointwitter too (primal).
As a thought experiment I see it a bit like this: would you join a decentralised social protocol (let's say it has the same characteristics as nostr) if it was ran by Ethereum or solana people. Eth or sol wouldn't be integral to the protocol however the vast majority of people using the protocol talk about Eth/sol, especially when the assets changes price.
I very much doubt most people here would tbh
Primal is a client which should only be recommended to bitcointwitter people tbh. And even then I wouldn't
@fiatjaf can you or some big shot here at nostr do something to bring influencers or other kind of creators? Maybe a little sparkle is all it needs. I don't think we should be pushy as well, people can find it when needed.
the audience of nostr-as-really-decentralized-social-media is a pretty small one and most of the vocal nostriches have been oblivious to what this actually means.
the audience for nostr-as-a-base-for-social-media in a general sense like how slack and discord and telegram are social media (as in, without the global feed of twitter/facebook/instagram) hasn't been even approached yet. there are a few of us who see this use case but most of us don't have funding behind us.
i think that the architecture of nostr could be improved, i talk extensively about it and have done some work on some ways to improve it, but i think that in practice you can deploy the technology already, if you can find the selling point of the benefit of the simple, and easily replicated model of nostr relay, which mostly means designing various kinds of consensus protocol between nodes, has yet to be done.
users don't care about the fact that their services are decentralized. what they care about is reliability, stability and those are things that nostr can deliver better, but not without these additional protocols to make redundant and fast content delivery.
it will take time.
the days of global feed, advertising monetised influencoor laden social media are coming to an end. people will like having the old style subject-specific forums of the 00s and 10s coming back. influencoor fatigue is a real thing, and will only continue to get worse as the tech reaches more people who were not interested in the popularity contest and TV substitute style.
IMO, it doesn’t help that as soon as someone joins, every "Nostr influencer", bot, and even some enthusiastic maxis start coaching them to set up a non-custodial wallet so they "can be zapped", which is supposedly "the Nostr experience". Most folks end up using something like Alby, receive a few sats, and then realise they have to pay to open channels, setup a ligthining node or sign up for an expensive cloud subscription just to actually receive their welcome zaps. It’s frustrating and feels like a scam. By that point, the damage is done... both to Nostr and to new users perception of BTC. If they were already sceptical, this just becomes "proof" that it’s all a scam. If they weren’t, chances are they’ll become sceptical now.
I’ve got nothing against Alby or any of the BTC businesses here, but if the BTC influencers, maxis, and businesses could please, please, stop sending newcomers down a path where losing sats and paying for unnecessary services becomes their very first experience with Nostr, I’d be immensely grateful.
By the way, before anyone says I’m exaggerating, this has happened to three different people I onboarded. The last one was
@Quokka (he/they). I’ve lost a few sats myself due to the non-custodial wallet "temporarily holds your sats until you pay" limbo.
To all the Lightning enthusiasts out there: if you really want new users to start zapping, just point them toward WoS or one of the other custodial wallets. You don’t have to like custodial wallets, and you can absolutely encourage users to move to non-custodial ones or withdraw on-chain once they have enough sats. Just don’t let their very first experience be “set up this very complicated stack or pay us $9.90 per month” so they can retrieve a few hundred sats received in their first month. Otherwise, you’re mostly damaging not just Nostr’s reputation, but BTC’s as well.
Its only feels a community cause its nascent
They wont come until they've figured out how to monetarise their following on nostr. We've already seen this with podcasts who had their channel deleted on YT (or elsewhere). They come to nostr, brag about how they had enough of the censorship, stream a week via zap.stream and then go back to YT when their channel is reactivated.
In other words, they only care about making money from their followers.
I've heard
https://kick.com/ paid a huge amount of money to bring influencers from Twitch. The influencers stayed like an year, pocketed all the money and then went back to Twitch.
primal is the best multi platform app for non technical people
if you think primal is the problem maybe you should look in the mirror
it's a parody of xitter
i think it's a problem that you chime in to whack-a-mole about why the use of nostr as a basis for a global central discussion system, and you don't care about the fact that there is more defense against censorship that happens when people can use a tool to easily spin up a system to have discussions like the old school BBS and are actively only funding this kind of work and don't get it that this is an extremely narrow way to use such a broadly applicable protocol.
defending primal and their use of a single cache relay network is unacceptable if you are serious about decentralization.
@ᴛʜᴇ ᴅᴇᴀᴛʜ ᴏꜰ ᴍʟᴇᴋᴜ is a comically retarded shoe pebble.
Yep. The set up a lightning address welcome bots pretty much guarantee kind 1 clients never take off.
Farcaster is also a protocol. So is Bluesky/Atproto. But on Nostr most people view Farcaster and the eth place and Bluesky/Atproto as the left place.
It's very hard for social protocols to overcome tribalism in 2025.
To me it's very clearly not one community. There are all kinds of whacky viewpoints and cultures on here that I do not vibe with. Nostr allows every individual to kind of find his own niche.
Wow.
I think people most often are retarded here 30 months into my Nostr journey
The visits here becomes more and more infrequent, soon signifying nothing
It's a Bitcoin community client. I think that's fine, but I'm glad people are realizing that there's more than one community.
Clients and relays should try to block these bots as much as possible. And honestly (I don't mind becoming persona non grata on Nostr) we should start calling out this kind of behaviour towards new users.
For example, if we see someone recommending that others install Alby Go (mentioning Alby again only because it's where plenty of new users end up), we should take the opportunity to explain that using a non-custodial Lightning wallet involves an upfront investment of both time and sats, as well as some technical knowledge to setup. We should also share a link to a reasonably neutral list of both custodial and non-custodial wallets, ideally with a couple of easy-to-understand paragraphs explaining the trade-offs, including the risks and a transparent breakdown of fees. (Same for Cashu stuff, etc, etc, etc).
That sucks, I hope you stick around as a streamer for a long time then! Hahaha 😁
Bitcoin is a protocol not a platform
You don't need your own Lightning Network node. A Coinos wallet does not require opening and closing channels by a user. Keep it simple for new nostr users.
🤪
Nostr is ideal for any niche community. You can run a private relay for goodness sake. It doesn't get any more niche than that.
Adriano Celentano
It's hard to make it sustainable then. But we must also remember that nostr is still growing and boosting initiatives like zap.stream , plebs.app and other content creators already in here will for sure help a lot in the long run.
The ecosystem is still growing and more people will come when they have enough content to consume in here.
And yet, here you are
No, that's not the problem with them. On nostr people see that they are fake decentralization
Primal is slick, it works etc etc. it is also heavily a bitcointwitter expat platform, I wouldnt recommend it to people who do not want the bitcointwitter experience elsewhere. The recommendations and sidebar are very much all gear towards that market and is extremely off-putting to anyone outside of that (it's even off-putting to some bitcointwitter people tbh lol)
#Nostr can become a home for artists, activists, developers, researchers, local communities and yes, for Bitcoin too.
But not only for Bitcoin.
Yes, I've never seen anyone serious here complain about Bluesky or Farcaster based on the content, I have no problem with their content. Their only problem to me is fake decentralization.
But yes, people in the external world do see Bluesky as a community of leftists, and Nostr shouldn't be like that but for the other side.
Someone has to make a new set of default relays, with a new client that people can be onboarded into but that doesn't feature a million bitcoiners posting all day.
The Japanese people did that with their geo-supremacist relays that only accept posts in Japanese made from Japan. We should prove it's possible to do it for other niches.
Exactly. Unfortunately, everyone points new users towards non-custodial wallets for a variety of reasons. Custodial solutions do carry risks, and we’ve had some pretty spectacular incidents in the past. But we need a more balanced approach than just "everything should be non-custodial... Must.. onboard... new... user! Must tell them to run a Lightning node… and a full BTC node… and buy this cloud subscription… and this box with software to run BTC + Nostr relays"... Just let new users chill a bit, let them say hi, post some cat pictures and follow a couple of people. If they want to setup a custodial wallet and get zapped for their cat pics, let them. If not, this is more than fine as well. We should 100% stop bombarding new users with all of the Lightning stuff.
For Lightning Network, using a custodial wallet is the way 99.9% of new Bitcoiners start. A self-custodial Bitcoin mainnet wallet makes sense from the outset, but not for Lightning Network wallet. The important thing for users to know about LN custodial wallets is not to store more than they'd typically carry in a physical wallet walking down the street.
I agree there are a lot of toxic Bitcoiners who scare people away from financial sovereignty and freedom. Such people are probably annoying in-person too.
You say that, but we're about to launch such a normie-friendly app and we'll see if you help promote it.
Every time you write one of these "someone needs to build" things, I assume you're just pre-marketing something already built, and it's always been true.
So, what is the new App Du Jour called?
We're doing that, but we're mostly doing it for particular implementations, i.e. for distinct organisations, who want to add "social interactions" to private or protected data sets.
I haven't been able to find individual people looking for "a place to post pictures on the Internet". The Internet is drowning in such general-purpose websites.
Are you serious? I don't think I ever "pre-marketed" anything like that. Can you give me some examples of when I've done such a thing?
There is also a budding Arab community with their own set of relays
You said we should add RSS and then you rolled out a RSS client right after that. And you did something similar for someone else, a while back, as a marketing help.
I think it's sort of unhelpful because someone with fewer followers (which is nearly everyone), might take you seriously and try to build something, and then find out he got rolled and feel dismayed.
I watch that go down, over and over, on here. All of y'all Big Accounts do it.
Call to Action, and then, "I have something prepared, actually..." or "Now that we have recognized this pressing problem, and spent days discussing it and generating hype, and fretting, here are the Same 5 Dudes getting a couple million dollas to fix it."
Ta-da!
It's incredibly discouraging.
"A Bitcoin community" - non bitcoiners should one day realize that bitcoiners were right, so they will join the community (nostr) where they can learn about other things (stuff) that those "bitcoiners" anticipate to be worth looking at.
Basically join the insiders group that got things right as they might be right again so they will not "miss the boat" again 😂
this is why i pretty much don't follow this clown
Obvious inside-baseball is obvious.
Whatever. I'm exhausted. Got shit to build. Later.
well thought out rebuttal. do you want a cookie?
id love a cookie. thanks for offering. 🙂
not exhausted enough, i think
good, diabeetus it is
did you have experience with the fediverse? people who are naive to it are guided towards mastodon instances centered around leftism and furry art, and they are led to believe that this is the whole network. it takes patience and extra effort to find the parts of the network that don't run mastodon or care for leftism.
I never looked at mastodon/fedi
Bitcoiners (and a handful of others) seem to be the only ones willing to stick out the low user numbers during the adoption phase (including buggy software).
If it ever becomes better than it is today it might expand beyond a bitcoiner group chat. I will enjoy it either way.
i looked at it years ago and there was a flurry of posts written in georgian. pretty text but i don't understand a word of it.
now i know a bit more about how this all works, practically all of these things that seem to end up being commie ghettos are just yet another initiative of Soros and co.
this is the main reason i'm on nostr. it's not full of commies. ok, some plenty bitcoin twitter cult drones but at least no commies.
get help for that little buddy.
and get better socialized. ❤️😂
Guilty. Not sorry.
I've been out in the wild since covid lockdown 2020. That person has since been chopped down and rebuilt amid the noise, the fear, ordered to believe when the exact opposite was happening right in front of me.
A menticide attack - a breaking of the mind.
I've picked up a few things in my learning journey.
We all have our own realities.
We have bills, ills, families that need attention, before we can even think about saving for a better future.
However, to be fair - your note suggests that we will become complacent, creating echo chambers where ideas stagnate and turn Nostr into a platform of stale slogans and empty rhetoric. I agree. This should not be a platform of Yes people.
If you agree to a note - back it up with a note of why.
If you disagree - same thing.
It opens up the dialogue - to learn, to adapt, to engage, to evolve.
Its not a matter of right/wrong, fact/fake - its a matter of beliefs and engagement.
This helps turn perception (BS) into perspective (reality).
Eng
I've never been this exhausted, in my life. Not even while alone for weeks with a newborn and a toddler.
Too techy for most communities to join. Filled with programmers and techy guys, not soccer moms chat, church groups or friday night football with the bros. Egg chicken problem.
I do my part by calling people idiots and starting fights as often as I can.
You are welcome 🫡
That’s why cashu is the way forward and we need to forget this idea of lightning micropayments
Isn't that an identifying feature of the community?
Coinos has been thoroughly compromised and should no longer be used!
What? No. I put out a bounty for Nostr integration in existing RSS clients and some people completed the bounty and integrated Nostr to some RSS clients. How is that "pre-marketing" or "marketing help" anything?
What else did I do?
Honestly if something is commercially viable it shouldn't be funded by OpenSats. OpenSats is not VC capital as far as I understand. And Nostr is not "data access and subscription", you don't need Nostr for that, you can run a server and provide that very easily without Nostr.
It makes no sense to pretend to like Nostr but actually just abuse it to build a proprietary business on top, there is plenty of space for businesses that adopt the protocol without destroying it, but for any of that to be commercially viable we'll have to go past the barrier of 1000 users and for that we need to appeal to nerds and idealists first.
#induecourse via doing we will find the way to onboard communities to nostr
cc
@Daniel D’Aquino @jb55It was your own RSS project.
We will! 💪
Well the soccermoms will never come here....they would be burnt instantly
You seem to be part of the borg, lately, rather than an independent actor. Maybe that's an unfair assessment, but if someone soon drops the solution to the problem you named, I won't make a surprised face.
My opinion doesn't matter, tho.
Okay, that seems plausible.
Fiatjaf said it was a “very warm and friendly” community
Good job reading 🫡
It's the people trying to build businesses, using Nostr, that care most about Nostr. We don't make any money, unless Nostr succeeds.
Everyone else has already received their reward.
find me an entrepreneur that isn't taking a risk on spending money on developing a product that they could be wrong, and i'll show you a unicorn.
"commercially viable" is a consequence of a good bet not something you can just throw money at until 100 monkeys types Macbeth.
anyone who is hiring monkeys gets an workspace covered in shit.
Is there a client that enables a new user to choose or enter a relay before keys are generated? I still think that is a winning formula. The dumbest of smart clients & the single relay, as the beginning of the path to everything else.
2 years ago, I was thinking that idea was such low hanging fruit that there was no way I'd be able to learn enough to try to make it happen before someone with some knowledge did it. I'm starting to doubt that now. 😅
That's their income, is the thing. And even if you substitute their income, you probably can't do so, indefinitely.
Why doubting #Fuck_the_jews technology like that?
There is a huge amount of normal people and influencers that just hate jews and precieve nostr as a #fuck_jews technology
We just hard-coded theforest in, as the core relay. That's why it's a community app: everyone who hosts it gets to select the core relay.
?? there is the theory and then there is the PRACTICE. it literally is mainly just crypto & bitcoiners.
Cashu is cool, and I use it. Alhough some Mint runners are currently charging quite a premium and we should call them out as much we call out the lighting payment services salespeople on Nostr.
Given that it's "newer" tech I think it's impressive for sure. I honestly have less issues with it than with Lightning nodes going offline, channels closing, etc. So I think that tech like Cashu or Spark may be a better alternative for folks zapping a few hundred or thousand sats a month on Nostr. Unfortunately I don't think that any tech will end the "custodial" debate though. No matter how efficiently the underlying tech mitigates risks, there always be trade-offs. Lets see how all of this evolve.
Custody of zaps is like arguing about who owns the dropped pennies on the street.
What we need is a good redemption process, stacking up a few zaps on a mint then withdrawing enough for a swap is best imo.
I am optimistic
Agreed. You just need to get everyone else onboard 😅.
Isn't Jumble like that?
Well, I asked that right before I took a nap, so... yes, pretty much. I actually haven't tried fresh keys on Jumble yet. I will do that. It hadn't even occurred to me what Jumble could enable for say... a farmer's market or a semi-pro arm wrestling association or a concert venue.
I see... are they prompted to do so on install?
Truth. Yet my personal is, they get #nostr in the time they deserve.
View quoted note →The real issue is media hosting.
If you use primal you are limited with how much you can post.
If you use any of the other clients it's complicated for new users to figure out.
Once we get a video scrolling client with its own hosting nostr will explode with new users.
Until then the majority of people are going to think it's just some whacky twitter clone
Nostr should swarming with activists and journalists. Those are the people that could really benefit from the censorship resistance
We need tiktok clone and a Facebook clone.
Nobody I know in real life uses twitter.
Everyone I convinced to download primal hated it and refused to even bother checking out amethyst or other clients after that.
Primal is a twitter clone.
It's the best app for twitter users.
I want to onboard Facebook users, tiktok users, YouTube users, Instagram users, Snapchat users etc.
I don't know anyone in real life that uses
twitter.
Everyone I convinced to download primal has hated it because it's a twitter clone and none of them are twitter users.
Primal is great for former twitter users. It's not great for anyone else and primal makes it difficult to find people worth following compared to any of the other clients I've tried.
If amathyst had it's own dedicated media storage like primal i really think nostr would have about 100 times more active users
Yeah…
Personally I’m hopeful that one of nostr’s top accomplishments can be enabling use cases and functionalities for bitcoin.
I’m not technical but from what I heard blossom servers could also be a cool (tweet-unrelated) tool offered to independent artists and companies…. By independent artists/engineers and companies.
Nostr seems like a great protocol for people making things others need meeting people needing things other people make.
Well, maybe if people talked about things other than Bitcoin
and Nostr existing users were more inclusive toward those who do talk about other topics on Nostr,
then the stereotype wouldn’t have taken hold in the first place.¯_(ツ)_/¯
Have you considered why it is this way? And what that means?
そんな少ない🙈
Nostr, social media app for people involved in a ponzi scheme.
you have to start somewhere
You know at the beginning apple computers were used by doctors, artists, scientists, because of the "simple usage" against windows... now, even if a macbook is more expensive than a PC with windows, Mac products are bought and used by any kind of users.
I think for #nostr it is quite the same, they are a lot of good people here with deep mind. Yes, this is used by a crypto community but not only.
People will come here, but not in a massive move.
Perception is interesting to know, to adapt nostr marketing and make it more easy to use for everyone.
But, i still think there is no reason to worry, just continue to use it as we do. We are not in a little vision here but a long marathon.
Nostr is not "the place to be" (without any reason to be there).
It is the place where you decide to be, and this is the most important point, for current and new users.
It is just up to us to give more reasons to come here.
#grownostr
@npub14dny...cpqf why people external to Nostr perceive it as a single community of "crypto" or Bitcoin lovers, and how to change that perception of nostr which is neutral, open protocol that can accommodate any type of community ?
perception = reality
We keep building and with time ⏳ they will come, 1 by 1.
@npub14dny...cpqf why mass people see Nostr as a community of crypto lovers? And how to change that perception of nostr as a neutral, open protocol that can accommodate any type of community ?
I got involved in a similar project in 2011 called Space Monkey, they sold out to a larger company who suppressed the technology so it wouldn't compete.
Things eventually emerge again:
Space Monkey (company) - Wikipedia
The bit is an item of a horse's tack.
Its origins stretch 4000+ years to 4200 BCE.
Bit wear is a sign of horse-riding, and the dating of horse teeth with signs of bit wear gives clues for the dating of the appearance of horse-riding.
#Bit #coin #bitcoin #history
Yeah, the relay settings are in the config.
We also pull user lists, if they login, but we've found that user lists are usually band, lol, primal, and damus, so pulling in their lists completely degrades their experience and fills our network up with porn, spam and garbage. So, we might stop pulling in their lists.
You have to generate the keys before selecting relays, as you use the keys to sign the relay list kind 10002. I mean, you could do it the other-way-around, in the client, but then you'd only have the list in the cache. If they cleared the cache, they'd lose their relay settings.
We have an onboarding wizard that goes step-by-step, for the user lists, but the client needs to have good default selections. Otherwise, everyone really does end up with a relay list full of big aggregators, which is pointless.
To talk about stereotypical "Nostr users" is to reinforce the problem.
You have to start in a niche before you can conquer the world. The good thing about Bitcoiners is that they'll be very rich in the future. That alone will attract people who want to be where the "elite" hang out. In some ways, it's similar to Facebook (before it became Boomerbook). Initially, it was only accessible to Ivy League students. People wanted to get involved because it was perceived as some elite network.
I see this. 90% of my feed often ends up being just crypto circle jerking and very specific left-libertarian hot takes. It’s the reason I still have an X account despite seeing a MUCH more promising future here. The infrastructure on Nostr is unparalleled from what I’ve seen of other ecosystems. But it definitely has a specific niche audience with some diversity of opinion issues that makes it hard to serve as the town square it really should.
That being said (and before I get the expected “do something about it” comments), alleviating that is a role I seek to fill, since I’m here. It really HAS been a welcoming community for the most part (one single disrespectful person so far to the contrary). And the decentralization and gatekeeping-free monetization potential have definitely turned this into my new internet home.
I also will likely start migrating some of my YouTube/rumble/X audience to this ecosystem. Gotta spread the word.
#grownostr #diversityofopinion #diversity #community #socialmedia #monetization #sats
View quoted note →We're missing the point with this "nostr needs to be for other people than bitcoiners". You can't believe in hyperbitconization and orange pilling the world and then say "but other people don't like to play with us".
Maybe the idea is to make bitcoiners the most awesome group of people to hang out with and everyone wants to join nostr because of that?
Another point is also since we're focusing on other things now - if other stuff have product market fit and it solves peoples problems then people will come naturally.
Nobody needed to be orange pilled to buy things from silk road, they saw the utility because they wanted the product. Why does nostr have to become something else to please the broader crowd, maybe it can just become awesome enough that everyone wants to join the current crowd?
View quoted note →What client did you use to post that?
primal
The cost of operating a social media machine is relative to the money coming in (ads) vs the money going out (operating costs)
Explaining to normies how #Nostr is overcoming this is one way.
@miljan please please include the "nostr:" prefix on these quotes!
99,9% das pessoas do meu dia a dia nem tem ideia disso aqui. Quando converso com eles parece que sou lunático para eles.
Hey
@aljaz which Primal app (ios/android/web) did you use and which version?
I think Reddit-like communities and hashtags have more probability of success than themed clients because I think it's better if users don't have to think about clients much, if they "just work".
It is both and neither.
It is more of a platform than FTP, but more of a protocol than Facebook.
It feels enough like a platform and behaves enough like a platform, a decentralized and censorship-resistant one, that it makes sense to describe posts as being "on Nostr".
Note, however, that the two things can work together: communities can be attached to specialized relays (the use of which would be automatic, without users having to do anything) and specialized relays could mirror posts that use certain hashtags from other relays.
However, I think the most crucial kind of relay to have is the general, content-neutral, free speech, free of charge and privacy-preserving one. Nostr makes it possible because running a relay is much cheaper than running a classical centralized platform and it can be a good way of contributing to the core human right to freedom of speech. It'd be nice to see Nostr relays from relevant non-profit organizations.
The real way it's overcoming this is by being cheap.
Relays run by benevolent volunteers and free clients work just fine.
Many people underestimate what can be achieved by cutting money out of the equation.
Using Apple products is a bad idea. Users give up control.
I hope if people come to Nostr it will be for the opposite reason.
Since media isn't hosted on Nostr, any censorship-resistant way to share media could and should help any decentralized platform, not just Nostr.
Or anyone wishing to say "cisgender" without Elon Musk shadowbanning them.
Hacker News is techy too, but it is quite successful. It'd be nice for Nostr to be anywhere Hacker News.
Tesla got alternating current right, but obsessed Tesla fans are boring as shit and one wouldn't want to be on a social media platform where half of all posts are about alternating current.
> However, to be fair - your note suggests that we will become complacent, creating echo chambers where ideas stagnate and turn Nostr into a platform of stale slogans and empty rhetoric.
It might already be that in part.
A lot of people you don't know use Twitter. Twitter is big, many people use Twitter.
Fair point sir. I tried to be positive 😂
Shosho creates a key for you when you open it for the first time. The goal is that you can use it without knowing what Nostr is.
@fiatjaf we looked into this;
@aljaz didn't use our quote UI, but simply pasted the nevent into the note editor.
We probably don't want to modify the note content for the user when they are editing it in code view (the only option in the current web app). We are soon going to have a WYSIWYG note editor for the web app, which will take care of these things autimatically.
I was a little confused by that at first, only because its so quick. I was able to find where I sign in & whatnot really easily. Do you think you might link out on the profile page to somewhere that you can edit your account eventually? That might be a neat introductory flow to Nostr overall. "Copy private key & visit *some acc manager* to manage your profile"
Awesome, that will be good, thank you.
There's nothing wrong with wanting other people on Nostr and working towards that end. That's the whole point of it
Some clarifications to this point made on a related thread:
fiatjaf
Well, that was poorly phrased, what I actually meant was: not all the people have to talk about Bitcoin all the time. Some people of course will, and that is fine and good, it's just not great that we _only_ have those people on Nostr currently.
This is of course a hyperbole, we don't just have these people, but we have a lot of them, and that is one of the factors that make some people (who may even like Bitcoin, I know some) not want to use Nostr.
I'm not saying people reading this message should stop talking about Bitcoin, that's not what I'm saying, please. In fact I'm not saying you (the generic reader of this note) should do anything.
All I'm doing is raising a point and hoping there may be some solutions (probably related to using relays to organize content, loosely-defined communities and niches of interest like I mentioned on my other note from yesterday and also tangent to
@npub10000...vwqk's idea) that we (by we I mean actually anyone reading this message that may have the urge to do anything) should look into implementing.
Thank you for understanding.
I've been hanging around without doing very much, so far.
Motive for being here at all: escaping the Censors of the Left, and the Censors of the Establishment. _My_ Internet, the one that I joined in the 1990s, is dead and gone, partly through the usual course of eventual concentration of corporate power, and partly through the malice of powerful people who freaked out at the intolerable spectacle of mere plebeians daring to say unapproved things to large groups, in ways the powerful people couldn't (then) readily control.
I can cope with a lot of Bitcoin posts, but I never propose to join the congregation of Bitcoiners, nor to post about Bitcoin.
I rather like the homesteaders and do-it-yourselfers but, for various reasons, will probably never have anything useful to say there either, since I can't follow that path.
If I go forward, that means bootstrapping a community that discusses other subjects I'm interested in. Starting from scratch means:
1. Committing to post on the subject most days; and
2. Making the content publically available, but concentrated in one findable place, so it's possible to recruit non-nostriches by saying "if you're interested in Y, sign up for nostr and do such-and-such";
3. Some mechanism of pest control. A small enough group can get along without it for a while, being scarcely noticed; a successful group will eventually need it.
1. is personal: it means finding the free time and dedication.
2. & 3. are questions about what's technically doable with nostr, and how? which I have not yet adequately researched.
Using apple product is easy.
I agree user give up control, and it is amazing some coders use macbook and sacrifice their privacy for an "easy to use" computer.
i said nostr was like apple, not for the privacy but for the way they have been used only by some specific communities before they become mainstream.
And for nostr, i think it will be the same. If the reasons to use nostr are enough "sexy" for mass people.
drop the meme coins brooooo
I'm pretty certain it's not just one community, I've once followed a reply about "marking npubs as nsfw" to an account posting very little other than soft porn and almost all the people he interacted with were trans communists. Since then I'm not leaving my little bubble of bitcoiners, nostr devs, and libertarians.
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#2 🔥 Community Highlights
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1. A question from a pleb to himself
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2. Interesting quote from a pleb
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3. Now you get that the centralization and censorship is bad
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4. The Creator speaks about Nostr
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5.
@Vitor Pamplona speaks about #amethyst drafts
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6. The Nostr Anniversary
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7. Fully on decentralization, deleting centralization
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8. Yes, that is true
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9. First post of a Pleb on
@Damus
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#community_nostr_recap
อ่านคอมเม้นท์กันจ้า
fiatjaf
Many people external to Nostr perceive it as a single community of "crypto" or Bitcoin lovers.
People inside Nostr also feel like they're in a very warm and friendly "community" too.
One perception probably reinforces the other, and both damage the idea of Nostr as a neutral, open protocol that can accommodate any type of community.
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False
Negativo. O Nostr deixa de ser "neutro" a partir do momento em que seu principal desenvolvedor resolve, do nada, agredir os usuários do próprio protocolo que desenvolveu, a ponto de fazer uma lista chamando-os de analfabetos e, oito, de semi analfabetos (ou minimamente letrados, como preferir). E tudo isso por mero rancor ideológico, irrefutavelmente.
Esse é um "protocolo neutro que pode acomodar qualquer tipo de comunidade"???
Certamente não. É evidente que há comunidades que não são bem vindas por aqui. E você sabe por quê? Por que você politizou o protocolo, querido. Você tem um lado, o NOSTR (em caixa alta) tem um lado. Nada por aqui é "neutro". E você sabe perfeitamente que 99% das pessoas pensam como eu.
Engane quem quiser. Não é por acaso que já criaram listas para bloquear usuários do Nostr lá no Bluesky. Quem sabe, sabe. Engane os leigos que chegaram ontem à Internet de paraquedas. Você é um conhecido small dick energy. Um arrogante far-right que age sob um pseudo anonimato.
Bem-vindo a 2022. O retrocesso vai de de vento em popa. E nada é por acaso... Somente idiotas permanecem.
The thing is though, let the losers who don't care to check before they assume isolate themselves away from truth. It's fine. They're doing their part to leave us alone.
fiatjaf
Many people external to Nostr perceive it as a single community of "crypto" or Bitcoin lovers.
People inside Nostr also feel like they're in a very warm and friendly "community" too.
One perception probably reinforces the other, and both damage the idea of Nostr as a neutral, open protocol that can accommodate any type of community.
View quoted note →
Do we expect here a suddent change from one day to another to have everthing on nostr?
Do we measure the number of people who are not talking about Bitcoin day by day?
Do we know how non-bitcoin related things evolve on nostr?
