Replies (103)
They need to work harder and outgrow their own cult 503 cult
Unless they want to keep it a cult.
Which way 503-man?
I gave Shakespeare something to do.
Let's see what it comes up with.
Of course thereโs good apps like Amber, Amethyst, Citrine, etc.
But ideal is to have that all in one app.
Good ui.
Most people use social media they donโt have to think about servers, passwords, media hosting, etc.
I like the open source aspect of Nostr of course but itโs just annoying to have 5+ apps just to experience a similar baseline experience, and at any given time 2 of those apps are broken.
Iโve said it plenty of times Iโll say it again.
Better timeline mechanisms similar to one per follow but more of a daily catch up, start from the first note posted today, and scroll up to recent notes, and maybe also some WoT based timeline (kind of like a for you thing).
Better NSEC/NCrypt1 based mechanism that works like traditional password recovery for keyless noobs.
Of course this wonโt fix all of nostrs problems but it will shrink the gap enough to allow us to have a user base.
People want visibility, if they feel like they arenโt being seen, and posting into a void they wonโt use it especially if itโs complex.
People would be better off using a journal without traction.
Iโm sure thereโs more problems but personally I see those as things that would at the very least help stop the bleeding.
Nostr needs marketing and we can use cashu tokens as part of that marketing. At least I think so, but I'm not the only one.
Zeus wallet and FediMint had the same idea.
Last year's Stone Ridge newsletter really got me thinking about this. Ross Stevens' idea of the business "business card is back" idea really resonated with me.
Your business card is pretty good too.
These worked well at the conference and
@EVAN KALOUDIS did an amazing job with them. What other events should we make it rain?
I love Amethyst but Amethyst has problems still. I get annoyed on the daily that someone is replying to me and I can see their profile name or profile photo.
I think the nsec flow is a large one for many people.
Tipping should default to cashu (more private and less annoying than ln imo) and there should be some way of gamification to use nostr and to onboard new users
Itโs not like thatโs new?
You do realize we did stuff like that with bitcoin over a decade ago now right?
Hey
@Derek Ross, we've seen a growth in Hydraveil subscriptions with the introduction of Nostr identities for VPN node operators. I think you'd make a great operator, and help Nostr adoption. It's a low-time commitment & easy setup, and really goes into your point about new ideas from the community.
I'm experimenting with this little project where 1 I collect trash from natural surroundings (very bad state where I live...) 2 post a note on nostr 3 upload the data (trash collected from environment and zaps received on nostr) to a spreadsheet and then display the info on a little webpage.
There's a zapper ranking, and other clues to try incentivise zapping. Does it fit in the gamification range? For me, it really is a structure I haven't seen on Nostr and that many people could enjoy for many activities ๐๐งก
Limpieza de playas + Bitcoin Nostr Zaps | Trash is Cash | Cash are Sats
Limpieza de playas y zonas naturales recompensada con Bitcoin (sats) vรญa Nostr. Seguimiento en abierto: salidas, volumen recogido, zappers.
I think there are still things to do.
Prague is next for us in June
When I detect bugs in my own apps like VidStr, I'm immediately fixing them.
Ah yes, there was something in the past where people thought their brain wallet would be safe but then they lost their Bitcoin because they used a very easy-to-guess password.
oh wonderful, another vibe-coded slop app that won't be maintained ๐
Well said!
This is just a proof of concept. I have many other apps I maintain more.
OK fair enough... Snarky response aside, I think the thing that I'm personally reacting to is the idea that the solution is ... "QUICK! To the SlopMobile!" I.e. let's just build another app / let's just ask AI what the problem is.
Personally what I think, like Bitcoin was once you get to about ~2014-15, we have apps that are "good enough."
You want "normie Nostr"? Look at what Ditto is doing. Look at DiVine.
If we want Nostr to grow, this isn't a "coding" problem, it's a social problem. Why are people comfortable on X / Facebook? Is it that they're *uncomfortable* on Nostr, or they're *too comfortable* on X?
I have to renew my passport. How many conferences do you go to a year?
DiVine is a big step, yes. It also got lots of attention.
... what I always see when looking in my own video client, VidStr, in the explore tab. Lots of nude shorts and videos that don't even have a content warning. But not only, thankfully.
It's interesting to hear your narrative... I came to Nostr in 2025, never having used microblogging before. Like any small new internet thing, Nostr is culturally dominated by SW Developer voices. And SW Devs look at problems as nails to solve with their "SW" hammers. So the solution is, "what haven't we built yet"?
But that's not the problem, and I think your narrative points out why. 2023-24 was pre-Trump. The people who were engaging with Nostr at the time were doing so when they thought that they were all going to get censored off the internet.
Well, now enter 2025, and Elon's tripping balls on the Dais behind Trump's coronation. "DADDY'S HOME FOLKS, BACK TO X!!"
The people who left throughout 2025 did so because *they don't see a problem* with the current system now that Trump's in the WH and Elon's running X. They don't see the problem with the fact that Catturd gets an algorithmic boost over the NY Times.
The system we *need* to be making inroads with is Mastodon, because that's actually the only decentralized social media that has gained anything resembling traction. But the bridges are defective, poorly maintained, and generally shunned because of the political culture there.
I think it's a UX problem, which is ultimately an engineering problem. We'll solve it. The issue lies with making decentralized tech work well enough for normie mode. A lot of trade offs and new ways of doing things without a backend need to be designed and built. It's not easy.
Nostr does not need marketing. What is the point of scaling something that is given free without ads? Burning more money of the free relay operators?
Everything needs marketing for growth. Grassroots movements are a form of marketing too.
I mean obviously there are a lot of "chicken and egg" issues, and I'm loathe to say "oh no the apps are all 'good enough' " --- but people are staying on XMeta not because those UX's are good. In fact, in many instances, they're crap UX. And the users know it.
Ditto is already a way better app than Instagram... cleaner UI, more responsive, easier to navigate, etc.
They're staying there because of network effects.
For growth. Why does Nostr NEED growth though? It's a nice commmunity here. It continues growing organically. Forcing growth feels dilutionary
Yes, but paper Bitcoin means something else these days. We need a paper Bitcoin revolution. ๐
Sustainability.
What do you think about my apps in that regard?
Itโs social media for fucks sake. Its value scales with the user base. The reason people post on X and YouTube is because thatโs where the people are. If you want a thriving social network economy, you need users.
Removing support for external signers while prioritizing google sign in isnt "trying something new," its neutering your product just days after getting some shitty grant from OpenSats. Clearly, this is going to be a trend. Wisp is done, it was nice while it lasted. Ill keep using this version for as long as I can, though
The people who made nostr their careers and source of income need it to grow.
And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. For some reason me saying this strikes a nerve.
If my source of income was nostr, I would want it to grow. This is just human nature.
Yeah. A lot of the funding comes from Non-Profits like
@OpenSats.
More users = More Non-Profit money
More money for Non-profit organizations = More people working on building a better nostr.
Itโs just normal incentives.
I want normies on nostr
Honestly IDK, what have you made? (humble suggestion for creators to put stuff they're most proud of in their NIP-05 profile block ๐ )
VidStr โ Nostr Video Client
Upload, watch and share videos on Nostr. NIP-71 video events, Blossom uploads, HLS streaming.
LiveWave
LiveWave โ Decentralized Live Activities on Nostr
Discover and join live streams, meeting spaces, and interactive events powered by the Nostr protocol (NIP-53).
Nostr Images
Nostr Images - Decentralized Image Board
Share and discover images on the Nostr network. A decentralized, censorship-resistant image board powered by NIP-68.
Nostr Music
Nostr Music - Decentralized Music Platform
Upload and discover music on Nostr. A decentralized music platform built on the Nostr protocol. No gatekeepers, no censorshipโjust pure music fre...
NostrDocs - Decentralized Document Sharing
Share and discover documents on the Nostr network. Upload PDFs, spreadsheets, and more - anonymously or with your identity.
PressStr
PressStr โ Magazines & Ebooks on Nostr
Discover and publish magazines and ebooks on the decentralized Nostr network. Censorship-resistant publishing via Blossom file hosting.
And many more - they are all on the homepage at
Shakespeare - Open Source AI Builder
Build custom apps with AI assistance using Shakespeare, an open-source development environment
Boo. The whole point is Zaps are supposed to replace that.
The thing is, once Nostr gets to a certain size, Zaps will cause it to be self-reinforcing. XMeta can't duplicate this model.
But it's a pure numbers game until then. Creators only need ~1% of people to pay for content, once numbers get to ~5 or 6 figures. If we even had Mastodon numbers it would be self-reinforcing.
Sort of interesting that my own engagement has gone way up since then.
LOL... Source: "AI said it"
Of course an AI trained on existing social media monetization models would claim that's "the only way"
Yes, AND -- Zaps are the superpower. Once this scales, zaps will disrupt every other social media.
It will be a no-brainer once your post can reach 10k, 100k, 1M people -- and whatever ~0.2% of those can zap you 10's of satoshis -- *everyone* will come here.
What's the magic number? IDK, but probably at least a few 100K DAU's -- I.e. Mastodon scale. We get there, and it becomes unstoppable.
Yes but they're both "revenue." Advertising was always a "kluge" for the internet because there was no built-in monetization model.
"Social media cannot survive without advertising revenue" and yet Mastodon has at least 10x the user base of here. And WE have Zaps.
If creators can directly post on Nostr and receive Zaps, why do they need ads?
It's a long story. Very complicated. Extremely difficult to understand and explain. Requires higher maths, diagrams, and logical proofs.
_Short version:_
Some people dropped a ton of money and aren't getting timely returns on their investment.
The rest of us are having fun enjoying the network effects we have... here.
I'd love to hear the long version, but I also don't necessarily want to blow up
@Derek Ross 's inbox with what's already a "megathread" ๐
Everyone is doing something different, but none of them are perfect. It's a huge waste of effort.
I feel as tho the marketing/advertising is VERY LOW, I would be here if I didnโt find one random podcaster mention it
Other than that I donโt see it promoted anywhere, ever
How do you grow/scale without promotion???
I totally agree! Iโm not an IT pro. I see myself and my project as a bridge.
I have a lot to learn myself when it comes to the technical side of things.
Take Bitcoin, for exampleโif only someone had told me about its potential before 2020, my life would have turned out differently. Keyword: free press. There are some really cool people who also want to make a difference, but technology just isnโt their forte. But it could be helpful if it were more accessible.
theres correlation with bitcoin price and people not feeling poor as well, wait til we start exiting the mega depression.
What kind of ads do you mean? Like a nostr billboard or something?
I think I have found a way to make mainly children and adolescents interested in even trying NOSTR, instead of talking to them about bitcoin, I began to show them the methods in which one could upload videos and how one does not need emails or hand over a lot of personal data just to have an account, that's the main thing I noticed, most children are not interested in bitcoin, they are more interested in watching and making videos and discovering a place where they do not need to go through a single central server where they can ask them to self-censor or modify what they did, mainly 10-year-old children are already interested. interest in trying NOSTR.
many, instead of looking for alternatives to fiat, what they are looking for is how to reduce their dependence on Google emails or they are looking for how to escape the regulations that are being imposed on them on centralized pages.
Nah dude just use bitcoin, monero, and doggie coin
Too many. It's usually 2-4
And mine.
Password123!
Yeah. Whoever uses such a password...
Do you mean "can't see their profile name ..."?
Some developers (this includes ones I've worked with outside of Nostr), have a blast making new features, and never want to go back and refine the details.
As soon as the new feature meets basic functionality in the happy path, they move on, and don't go back until someone rubs their face in the non-happy path bugs, or gross usuability issues.
When a typical users encounters several frustrations in a short period of time, they develop a negative view that is difficult to change. It's ideal to never let them get to that point in the first place.
I'm at a point where I don't see any current versions of a Nostr social client that I would recommend to a friend. There are some "other stuff" apps that are solid, so maybe that's how I'll introduce Nostr. I'll be sure to add the caveat that "Nostr social clients are mostly a crappy experience, or require unsecure practices." ๐ซค
Profile data never loads.
I hope that every decentralized tool gains widespread adoption. Thatโs because I believe the concept of decentralization is, in my view, the ultimate framework for how we canโand shouldโorganize ourselves as a society in the future. I truly see it as a very broad and comprehensive solution to so many issues! And Nostr, among others, conveys this idea! The issue of relays and the associated costs needs to be resolved in a fair way.
i think i've had nearly the oposite experience. nostr engagement has only seemed to grow for me since 2023, with thing feeling like they are exploding this year. really don't see the problem. same with the focus of interest coming from devs. i've seen a number of devs build cool things that inused only to abandon them. i've come to learn from that that relying on devs to build nostr is not the right path. the user community needs to be the one owning the future of this space. tools like Shakespeare (and just AI in general) can make that an accessable reality. i don't even care if things feel a little broken here. i use only nostr for my social media and have no plans to go anywhere else.
Yes. What I wanted to say is, whoever uses such an unsafe password sbouldn't be surprised when it's cracked or guessed.
Yes my point is that the restrictions on passwords to use upper and lower case, numbers and special chars, doesnโt necessarily make good passwords.
What would you think of a protocol, built on top of Nostr, that could bridge the gap between Nostr identities and their use in the physical world, as well as further expanding their usability in the digital world? Iโm thinking of verifiable credentials / ZKPs...
Do you think this could help drive the adoption of Nostr, which could then become to e-ID what Bitcoin is to fiat currencies?
Protocols compete; Nostr and Mastodon are at odd with each other; you will be hard pressed to convince people on Mastodon to switch to Nostr, unless they ran an instance for a while and can see things on Nostr make more sense.
Oh and bridges just suck
Yes, they compete -- but it's also the only platform that we can actually interoperate with, unlike XMeta. Once they can see the superior monetization model it'll be inevitable they come here. In the meantime, we get their content and 500k DAU's "for free."
Yeah, bridges are meant to be temporary. They should work until they're not needed anymore.
Ai is the thing now... Social is dying...
I posted somewhere the idea of having a chat ai like nostr with wiki creation and taxonomies... This would be more of a tool and a completely new concept...
Copying Twitter takes us just halfway... We gotta start innovating...
You can look at the stats. Data doesn't lie. It's been trending down for a very long time. Of course there could be outliers and perhaps you're one, but most people's have gone down.
Most of those npubs weren't talking to small fry, like me. I didn't notice them coming. I didn't notice them leaving.
Also, a lot of the most-active npubs I was talking to then, I am still talking to now, but not in the public Nostr feeds. So, I can see them, but you can't.
Data doesn't lie, but it isn't information. Information requires interpretation.
Divine has been the biggest source of activity in my purview since it launched, and aside from bugs, it's been by far the most streamlined on-boarding into the network for the normie.
The complexities still exist in one form or another, and even with telling people "hey, you've got something far more wild than you realize on your hands"... Most of them don't dare try.
Now sure, we've got 'algorithm' feed options in some clients, but in general the feed is a canonical firehose that doesn't know a thing about the user or their mental triggers.
Without it, Nostr is a social media detox.
Without it, people scrape the barrel for dopamine.
Without it, they relapse back to normieland where they can get all the cheap dopamine they could want. Drip fed by corporate interests.
How do I join the marketing team?
Good thoughts Derek. Totally spitballing here.
One idea that comes to mind: Good plastic surgery doesn't look like plastic surgery. I like what Rabble is trying with DiVine. Bet you none of those people even know what nostr is.
To me the inflection point is: normies realize they don't need a new password for every app they just login with their extension and set & forget . That's underrated imo. The trouble is getting there. Some combination of "oh I didn't even know that was nostr" and a consortium of apps that lets me not worry about logins anymore is killer.
I agree. Ultimately technology is best when it fades into the background.
I believe in this social media more than any other, how can I participate in growing it?
Your content is in some cases not exactly child friendly.
Nostr, by itself, has little to no incentives to offer for normies to switch into.
Just like bitcoin. If you don't see the problem you don't value the solution.
Now bundle Nostr with a decentralized mobile OS on a new phone with built-in btc wallet that comes pre-loaded with actual KYC-free btc and call it "freedom phone".
View quoted note โYep true
@Derek Ross. I accept this. We want normies. IMO we need to make them feel not too technical here. Possibly first we can introduce them, the npub and nsec as the username and password. If they hear about npub and nsec as keys, they feel overwhelmed.
The other thing is we need to share more non-technical things here to make them feel very familiar here. For example, just like some family photos, vlogs whatever. When someone onboards, he/she sees there are too many technical notes here, it feels very overwhelming to them, and they go away.
I am doing my best with
@Nostr Recap. Also, it is publishing outside of Nostr too (X, Mastodon, Bluesky, Substack, Medium, Stacker and Reddit).
Btw, let's get this is as a bear market and stay humble. Let's get together and grow Nostr. We are still early. ๐ซ
Its interesting that a lot of Nostr users complain about X. But after a week on X, nostr seems so void and the left wing bias on here is a bit tiresome after a while. There 's no nuance when it comes to political discussions and the bitcoin commentary on here is not much better than on X.
We're left wing here? That's the first time I've heard anyone say that ๐คฃ It's normally right wing and libertarian political views.
There's nothing official here. You essentially have to come up with your own campaign and help existing projects, offering services.
We are all Marketing Team
What kind of growth are you expecting? Considering who we are up against I think nostr is doing fine. The longer nostr exist the more people will find it in time. I stumbled upon nostr years ago with no prompting and fell in love with the concept immediately.
People will find nostr in due time imo. I think being at places normies hangout and spreading the word is the best thing to do. Small incremental growth is all we need. I personally donโt like having normies here as they will bring their views and practices that make SM unbearable but thatโs just meโฆ
This a good take. In general we need to hide complexity until there is a high probability they want or need it. The nsec could be framed as their 2FA and I am hoping things like FROSTR become more easy to use and ubiquitous in the event of needing recovery (main reason to broach topic of keys at all)
But how will us people with abnormalities login?
It took me a couple of years to really understand the importance of Bitcoin. Without which, I doubt that I would have really understood Nostr, norunderstood the importance of Nostr.
And some people are not in Bitcoin for the reasons they say they are either.
There is a big cultural element outside the UX problems. Of those that have even heard of Nostr, thereโs a high percentage think itโs a Nazi bar and a lot of content is about money. That doesnโt chime with a lot of people. Now you could argue itโs not but Iโm not hear for that, just echoing what Iโve heard from people on the Fediverse, which like it or not, is full of FOSS/self hosting enthusiasts AND a lot of what folks here would call normies. (Which I find pretty ironic as a lot of people here focus on working hard and raising families Iโve seen like 1 furry and maybe 2 openly gay people in 3 years).
If WoT/suggested follows mainly consist of prominent Bitcoin people, that perception is unlikely to change.
I can very rarely stomach any suggested feeds here, My interest in money only goes so far, by now Iโve heard all the Bitcoin catch phrases and I still prefer Red Rogerโ 3,2,1. That man knew how to drop a catchphrase.
Iโm not hating. It is what it is.
The conversation is Bitcoin and the suggestions of people to follow are often Bitcoiners because someone had to use the protocol first. If it were furries then we'd be having the same conversation but wondering why people don't flock to the furry network. In the end we need a wide variety of people or at least people of different communities to take a chance on Nostr, otherwise it's just always going to be our niche.
Agreed.
โDev moronโ lmao dis retard doesnโt realize a Snapchat clone literally requires a camera screen?
Iโm living rent free in the minds of these low iq rage baiting monkeys who bring 0 value to themselves or anyone for that matter
once identified a jerk always remains a jerk even if changing npub
snap ur own anal hole - dumb ididots use snapchat like ur reference
there r jerks full in sov engg too - ur type gang is not alone sniffing for user data
Undoubtedly
Right? I was surprised at that "left wing" comment too.
#2
1. An awesome Bitcoin culture event is gonna happen this June in Warsaw ๐
View quoted note โ
2. These supports help a lot for the growth of Nostr ๐๐ป
View quoted note โ
3. Congrats to these love birds โค๏ธ
View quoted note โ
4. Letโs listen to some nice songs ๐ง
View quoted note โ
5. The Nostr promo effort of a Birthday nostrich ๐
View quoted note โ
6. What do you think about his opinion nostriches? ๐ค
View quoted note โ
7. Great! His vision is so powerful ๐๐ป
View quoted note โ
8. Letโs get together and help for his good effort ๐ซฑ๐ปโ๐ซฒ๐ฟ
View quoted note โ
9. Nostrich couple celebrate the decade of their love โค๏ธ
View quoted note โ
10. Vanished a while from Nostr to write a Bitcoin book ๐
View quoted note โ
11. Great news from Miljan about Pirmal Android ๐คฉ
View quoted note โ
12. As always, Derek tries to grow Nostr ๐๐ป
View quoted note โ
13. A Pretty lady musician becomes a nostrich ๐ต
View quoted note โ
#community_nostr_recap
