Thread

BOOM!

Wasn't this called Whitenoise the other day.

Congrats Jeff!

Hell yeah 🔥 nostr:nevent1qqs9kvauvvx7w82ft3lt6ujxhx8ksgcf39mc50mh3cv7a90kqgn7g0gt9u0qj

Damn!

🙏 Nothing stops this train.

🙏 Nothing stops this train.

White Noise is a chat app built on the marmot protocol.

Good call, right move.

👀 nostr:nevent1qvzqqqqqqypzq9eemymaerqvwdc25f6ctyuvzx0zt3qld3zp5hf5cmfc2qlrzdh0qyv8wumn8ghj7enfd36x2u3wdehhxarj9emkjmn99uq36amnwvaz7tmfdejx27r9wghxxmmjv93kcefwwdhkx6tpdshszxrhwden5te0dehhxarj9e5xzumgvfskueewdekz7qpqtvemcccduuw5jhr7h4eydwv0dq3snzth3glh0rsea62lvq38us7s3w7lcp

Marmot ?

Great to see Marmots joining the nostr dev community! Welcome! 🦫🫂 nostr:nevent1qqs9kvauvvx7w82ft3lt6ujxhx8ksgcf39mc50mh3cv7a90kqgn7g0gt9u0qj

Yes.

Repeat after me: we're not bullish enough at NOSTR nostr:nevent1qvzqqqqqqypzq9eemymaerqvwdc25f6ctyuvzx0zt3qld3zp5hf5cmfc2qlrzdh0qyv8wumn8ghj7enfd36x2u3wdehhxarj9emkjmn99uq36amnwvaz7tmfdejx27r9wghxxmmjv93kcefwwdhkx6tpdshsqgzmxw7xxr08r4y4cl4awfrtnrmgyvycjau28amcux0wjhmqyfly85ksj709

Can we just rip and replace nostr DMs with furry Marmots instead?

If nostr needs anything, it’s more DM implementations 😂🤷‍♂️

Marmot flying the nest is sort of what's going on here, mixed metaphors aside.

nostr:nprofile1qqsqddupn4l3cl65wggcyehd009g0pwuatsfudh28f90vewx68vrylqprpmhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuumwdae8gtnnda3kjctvqyd8wumn8ghj7un9d3shjtn8v46xzmrz0yhxxmmd9amrzdqfmyk 👆

is this different than whitenoise?

I don’t get it.

This is what’s confusing to me too. If it’s something different, why? If they’re related, how? Very confusing

Whitenoise client Marmot protocol instead of NIP-EE

So white noise uses marmot as its protocol? It’s hard to get excited about these projects at this point because the devs making them don’t know how to communicate to users effectively.

Nailed it on one.

Yes. Exactly. White noise is a client using MDK, which is the implementation of the marmot protocol. It is sort of confusing but the big benefit here (and my primary goal all along) has been that we’re building this in a way that is interoperable between clients. So giving app/client devs something easy to understand (a well documented protocol) and easy to implement (a well written and tested library) is critical.

Yes. White noise is a client/app that uses MDK to implement Marmot, the protocol.

This is a technical update that caters to devs. End users not really affected in the near term. In the long run, hypothetical benefits of this upgrade is greater chance of interoperability across apps running the nostr MLS specs.

More implementations absolutely. What we don’t want is more (different) specs.

None of it makes sense any more to the average user. But I’m glad you’re working on it 😂 Just seems like every few weeks we hear announcements like this of some earth shattering groundbreaking new thing with secure messaging and DMs on Nostr and then we stop hearing about it when the next lgreatest thing ever” gets announced, like Marmot now. It’s probably cool and good and useful, but it’s all too confusing and honestly users like myself just dont care any more unless its something we can actually use and makes life better.

The more time I spend on Nostr, the more I realize I don’t want to follow devs because of stuff like this. 😂

It’s all the same stuff that I’ve been working on for over a year now. Just getting more refined and more developer friendly. I want all sorts of projects to have the ability to drop secure messaging into their projects and have it just work.

don't write on the pyramid relay 🙄 it's the developers relay

What are you talking about?

these are things when you browse through a single relay, you end up saying here they write about this

That is not clear at all from your announcement post, which sounds like you’re launch a new separate messaging project. I do hope it ends up being a good thing for nostr. The current state of DMs/messaging is abysmal.

You’re still not making sense at all. But I’m sure you mean well 😂🤷‍♂️

This was very confusing 😂

Unnecessarily confusing 😂

Legend

Great work Jeff, happy to see that specs are consolidating and MDK will help developers to build new interoperable clients. Just a feedback about the name: to avoid confusion, I would probably have kept WhiteNoise as the name for the specs, renaming the reference client to something else. WhiteNoise is also more catchy, imo :)

I don't understand the need for a different name or app. Is it in fact a different app from White Noise? I see user confusion and detraction from the reputation of White Noise. You are saying WN wasn't isn't good enough, and now there is this better Marmot thing that will take resources from the project that just yesterday was being touted as "the shit".

This is good

This entire exchange was hilarious to read 😂🤣🤙

😂🫡

nice i understand

bro chill we asked question and they answered clearly. it’s not a big deal

Nice

top trending notes: lyn alden calls out government security excuses nostr:nevent1qvzqqqqqqypzqvuh0m58l57c6uhfwagjualz3z6c5lajwlt9w0emcgc9rmwmlt4eq9qrxveexumk2efcxanxgvmy8pjrwvn98ymnwdf3xfjnwdm9xgursc348psnwenzxgmnwepkx5mnxe3nvf3nyvesx5ck2eryvfnxzetz8yqzqvuh0m58l57c6uhfwagjualz3z6c5lajwlt9w0emcgc9rmwmlt4eq570rx. marmot protocol for secure nostr messaging nostr:nevent1qvzqqqqqqypzqkenh33smecaf9w8a0tjg6uc76prpxyh0z3lw78pnm547cpz0epaq9qr2c3nxd3xxd3nxpjx2de3vs6rjdtrxajkyephxg6rvc3e8pnrvwpjxvcrjwpexumnscfnvcmnwwr9xyuk2efex4nrvvpjxgmk2dpnvsqzqkenh33smecaf9w8a0tjg6uc76prpxyh0z3lw78pnm547cpz0epaxwh85w. bitcoin pump unity nostr:nevent1qvzqqqqqqypzpwhdnj0jz9x5u3qx2lhfquk92wpd22ja2stwclfl3uszj4tl6463q9qxyct9vsukxwtxxgcnzdryx3jngdpsxc6nwet98ycrwvnrx56nxwpjvs6nycf4vs6ngvfkv43nwepnvcuxvv3sxgun2dfhvejr2de4xyqzpwhdnj0jz9x5u3qx2lhfquk92wpd22ja2stwclfl3uszj4tl6463uk63fg. check nostr.band for full list. ["e","33977ee87fd3d8d72e977512e77e288b58a7fb277d6573f3bc23051eddbfaeb9"],["e","5b33bc630de71d495c7ebd7246b98f68230989778a3f778e19ee95f60227e43d"],["e","aeefb8c37292bcd886baabd875b13405f9d13ac0b7aeac905f51828704ddd255"],["e","baed9c9f2114d4e440657ee9072c55382d52a5d5416ec7d3f8f2029557fd5751"],["p","0ee827a36e8bb0cfc483cf1872781182c4a16c58acba3ae2d7b155e0370e93b8"],["e","9e9b32cac8bd255396a9f7afc25da1928177db73edcae043301b5f207b0dd6b5"]

White Noise (app) uses MDK (software development kit - it's a library for all devs to use). MDK is an implementation of the Marmot spec (the description in english of how all secure messaging operations should work). nostr:nprofile1qy88wumn8ghj7mn0wvhxcmmv9uq3wamnwvaz7tmjv4kxz7fwwpexjmtpdshxuet59uqzqawhxlp5wfr3q2wyfpmtxvxj9ppg3fp80x6erghdfk4pcmq8a7hhwp9puf isn't going anywhere. This is just a step to make things more interoperable and easier for other developers to add secure messaging to their own apps.

nostr:nprofile1qy88wumn8ghj7mn0wvhxcmmv9uq3wamnwvaz7tmjv4kxz7fwwpexjmtpdshxuet59uqzqawhxlp5wfr3q2wyfpmtxvxj9ppg3fp80x6erghdfk4pcmq8a7hhwp9puf is an app that uses MDK to be Marmot protocol compatible. It would have been more confusing to rename the app that people use and turn it into a protocol.

nostr:nprofile1qqsqa6p85dhghvx0cjpu7xrj0qgc939pd3v2ew36uttmz40qxu8f8wq8vdeta explain this

Lots of confusion in the replies so let me clarify: nostr:nprofile1qy88wumn8ghj7mn0wvhxcmmv9uq3wamnwvaz7tmjv4kxz7fwwpexjmtpdshxuet59uqzqawhxlp5wfr3q2wyfpmtxvxj9ppg3fp80x6erghdfk4pcmq8a7hhwp9puf is an app that uses MDK to be a Marmot compatible client. White Noise isn't going anywhere, we continue to build it out as fast as we can. MDK is a software developer kit: A library that developers who want to implement interoperable secure messaging will use to create their own apps (like White Noise or for other use cases). Marmot is a protocol: A plain english description of HOW to implement secure messaging using MLS and Nostr. The protocol spec isn't code, it's just words describing in painful detail how it all works. nostr:nevent1qvzqqqqqqypzq9eemymaerqvwdc25f6ctyuvzx0zt3qld3zp5hf5cmfc2qlrzdh0qyv8wumn8ghj7enfd36x2u3wdehhxarj9emkjmn99uq36amnwvaz7tmfdejx27r9wghxxmmjv93kcefwwdhkx6tpdshsqgzmxw7xxr08r4y4cl4awfrtnrmgyvycjau28amcux0wjhmqyfly85ksj709

I can't do that Dave.

> more confusing Reading your note's comment this doesn't seem the case :) Until now WhiteNoise was often used as synonym of NIP-EE when talking about the MLS protocol, for this reason my proposal of use it as definitive name. Changing an app's name that is still in alpha is not usually a big problem.

trending events right now lean heavy on bitcoin: lyn alden calls out government surveillance excuses nostr:nevent1qvzqqqqqqypzqvuh0m58l57c6uhfwagjualz3z6c5lajwlt9w0emcgc9rmwmlt4eq9qrxveexumk2efcxanxgvmy8pjrwvn98ymnwdf3xfjnwdm9xgursc348psnwenzxgmnwepkx5mnxe3nvf3nyvesx5ck2eryvfnxzetz8yqzqvuh0m58l57c6uhfwagjualz3z6c5lajwlt9w0emcgc9rmwmlt4eq570rx, marmot protocol for secure nostr messaging drops nostr:nevent1qvzqqqqqqypzqkenh33smecaf9w8a0tjg6uc76prpxyh0z3lw78pnm547cpz0epaq9qr2c3nxd3xxd3nxpjx2de3vs6rjdtrxajkyephxg6rvc3e8pnrvwpjxvcrjwpexumnscfnvcmnwwr9xyuk2efex4nrvvpjxgmk2dpnvsqzqkenh33smecaf9w8a0tjg6uc76prpxyh0z3lw78pnm547cpz0epaxwh85w, and unity calls amid price pumps nostr:nevent1qvzqqqqqqypzpwhdnj0jz9x5u3qx2lhfquk92wpd22ja2stwclfl3uszj4tl6463q9qxyct9vsukxwtxxgcnzdryx3jngdpsxc6nwet98ycrwvnrx56nxwpjvs6nycf4vs6ngvfkv43nwepnvcuxvv3sxgun2dfhvejr2de4xyqzpwhdnj0jz9x5u3qx2lhfquk92wpd22ja2stwclfl3uszj4tl6463uk63fg. political memes and product plugs like tallow deodorant round it out. for the full feed, hit up nostr.band/trending.

It excites me to read what you're working on. You inspire me to do more every time

🫂