Replies (106)

Toby McMann's avatar
Toby McMann 1 year ago
#bitcoin can be a lonely journey. But, from each block to the next, much love and gratitude to you Freaks showing the way. 🙏
Zaikaboy's avatar
Zaikaboy 1 year ago
Moaning Mucker. Live free 🇬🇧🚒😎 #FreeSamourai #FreeRoss
- I DO NOT THINK THERE WILL BE MOTIVATION TO ACTIVATE A SOFT FORK TO “IMPROVE SELF CUSTODY” UNTIL FEE RATES RISE - I DO NOT THINK WE WILL HAVE A SOFT FORK THAT IS EVEN REMOTELY CONTENTIOUS AND STAKEHOLDERS ARE MORE DIVERSE THAN THEY HAVE EVER BEEN - IN THIS ENVIRONMENT AND GOING FORWARD I ACTUALLY LEAN TOWARD RESPONSIBLE HARD FORKS WITH FIVE YEAR OUT FLAG DAYS - THIS CONVERSATION SHOULD BE HAPPENING ON NOSTR, NOT X
Whats this 2nd point? Not clear as worded. Glad to see you say something about concrete about ways to improve the protocol 👍 "responsible hard forks" FTW
Vdub's avatar
Vdub 1 year ago
GOOD MORNING MATT. SHSS👊🏽
Do all the "L2's" pegged to Bitcoin skyrocket fees to make things uncomfortable enough? How technically literate are relevant stakeholders, from your perspective, to have good opinions on what is contentious? We hard fork inevitably, do we hard fork once to fix the technical issues (timestamp) and add other things? Or do you see mutliple hard forks over the years? Why five years? Why not 10? why not 1?
- WHEN MOST PEOPLE AGREE MEMPOOLS WILL NEVER CLEAR AGAIN. - NOT VERY BUT THAT ALONE MAKES PROPOSALS CONTENTIOUS. - FIVE YEARS IS JUST A NUMBER. NOT TIED TO IT. JUST A FAR OUT DATE SO FORK HAS MULTIPLE RELEASES NOT JUST ONE. BIGGEST CONCERN WITH A HARD FORK IS A BUG WITHOUT BACKWARDS COMPATIBLE CLIENTS.
BE GRATEFUL FOR WHAT WE WERE ABLE TO STACK AND DO BETTER GOING FORWARD. STAY HUMBLE AND STACK SATS. LIVE FREE. 🫡
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Rand 1 year ago
moar edu., moar engagement, moar network, - the real ngu imho/)........uP/
Most people would be more than happy to custodial LN or use ecash from a mint controlled by their bank. In general we need to stop pretending 95% people currently share or will ever share our values. Entertaining changes based on the assumption that one day people will all the sudden care about sovereignty is an error imo
LL62's avatar
LL62 1 year ago
GOOD MORNING 🤠🤙
GOOD MORNING POST MORE NOTES. ZAP MORE NOTES. REPOST MORE NOTES. FOLLOW MORE NPUBS. LIVE FREE. 🫡 #NOSTRONLY
That’s a lot of unknown risk for the sake of optionality that may never be exercised Either way, things have changed. The people that had influence no longer do so to the same extent or at all; they just don’t know it yet.
good morning, this is a test reply using primal. will somebody please reply to this if you see it. I don't see my posts/replies in the threads.
You sound like a crypto-bro. Many tokens had no technical issues with the protocol. This is why bitcoin is different. What is the problem bitcoin, as a protocol, set out to fix? Do you feel it appropriately addresses the problem?
Wut? That first statement made no sense. I’m asking what about the protocol is broken and needs to be fixed besides the unix timestamp issue? I’m guessing nothing since you didn’t point it out. The problem it fixes is well understood. I didn’t get here yesterday. Yes, i think the problem is appropriately addressed. These protocol changes are motivated by ideological reasons not catastrophic flaws in bitcoin’s design. “Everyone needs to own a UTXO” and the like. It’s not as if satoshi didn’t know not everyone was not going to be able to transact on L1.
The problem is UTXO ownership that doesn't scale. Resulting in capture and then the protocol is what the capturing party says it is. If everyone can always go to main chain consensus, capture becomes deterred.
"A purely peer-to-peer version of electronic cash would allow online payments to be sent directly from one party to another without going through a financial institution." If I am unable to go to main chain, I am now going through a financial institution.
sorry Matt reading comprehension problems here. now I don't understand why you think we can't possibly get an even *slightly* contentious softfork, but you think a hard-fork is possible...? couldn't reconcile those two things and my brain farted. how do you square that circle?
legacy finance and fiat degens coming in for NGU and advocating for ossification before the network is capable of scaling to provide widespread sovereign usage.
That statement is true today and will continue to be true. Anyone that wants to enjoy those benefits can today. The people that these changes are aimed to “help” don’t even know Bitcoin exists, they don’t care or like Bitcoin, or would rather use a financial institution. When these people that can’t transact on-chain and are actively using custodial LN or ecash, and the livelihood of their families depends on using Bitcoin sovereignly start asking for changes, then I’ll take it more seriously.
This is a subjective problem based on your opinion around UTXO ownership. Competition on higher layers addresses capture and censorship. But then again most people are perfectly happy with their banks and the idea of self custody feels crazy to them. Assuming this will change materially is delusional.
A MINORITY CAN HARD FORK SAFELY WHILE A MINORITY SOFT FORK COULD BE QUITE DANGEROUS. ANYONE CAN HARD FORK WITHOUT PERMISSION AND IT IS OPT IN.
the difficulty is that the direction the protocol is developed is according to the dominant values of community members. so if 95% of the users don't care about sovereign usage there is unlikely to work out well for us. regulatory capture is a real thing and Bitcoin is not inevitable.
Good morning Odell! Have been enjoying this Sunday with a long walk together with my wife and some cooking afterwards with some of our friends 😇 Have a great one!
- I think we'll realize private mempools before we have agreement on memepools never clearing. Then the status of mempools will live in eternal superposition of both clear and full. Do you think mempools should reflect consensus? - agreed. - The last part of this statement makes me ponder all the software dependecies that are built up by clients. For example, in the event of a hard fork, what side does BDK take?
I would rather scale at higher layers with tradeoffs there as opposed to introducing risk to the base layer. The lack of an existential problem makes unintended consequences resulting from a soft fork unnecessary, in my opinion. I would venture to say not many of the people pushing for soft forks are all in and have families to support. Not saying this is you, but it’s easy to want change when you’re a single dude with a $500 stack.
Family man talking about softforks with majority exposure in bitcoin. Count myself as another. I know personally one more.
average_bitcoiner's avatar average_bitcoiner
From jamesob on Xitter zaps to openSats BITCOIN CORE'S LOSS OF FOCUS The legacy technical leadership in bitcoin is becoming increasingly less effective. -- Almost universally, Core and "graybeard" devs are not focusing on _the_ fundamental problem in bitcoin: preserving trustless UTXO ownership. Instead they are distracted with valuable but secondary issues like mempool policy, Core code architecture, and minor IBD performance. These things are important in their own right, but they fundamentally don't matter if in times of trouble most users can't take possession of their own coins. Core devs are exceptionally talented people. The brightest engineers. But the priorities of the project are out of whack. The aggregate focus does not reflect the thing that makes bitcoin a unique asset: trustless custody. -- Given the current limits of bitcoin, even upper-middle class Americans will not be able to self-custody, let alone the rest of the world. If bitcoin doesn't figure out how to ensure that most users have a trustless way of owning and sometimes moving coins, it will become basically indistinguishable from a gold ETF. A row in some OFAC-compliant database. Another financial widget that is subject to the regulatory dictates of government. In fact, if bitcoin does not scale UTXO ownership, gold will have the advantage that at least small amounts of it *can* be self-custodied and traded peer-to-peer. The same won't be able to be said for bitcoin. In a world where on-chain fees are in the thousands of dollars and there is not a workable, trustless layer two, most coins will be stuck with custodians. Forget payments. I'm talking about savings. I'm talking about less than checking-account volume. 1-2 transactions a month. If you think that most people should be able to DCA and withdrawal to self-custody once a month, maybe spend once every few years for big purchases, I've got news for you: Given bitcoin's current limitations, only 18 million users can do that. A little over 5% of Americans. -- Right now, the chain capacity is able to meet demand for self-custody because we are in a time of relative peace. Most don't feel at risk keeping their bitcoin with a custodian. That can change very rapidly. As bitcoin grows in value and challenges fiat currency, governments will increasingly want to control it. They won't ban it, which is now obvious, but almost certainly they will impose OFAC-like restrictions and possible wealth taxes. When the regulatory hammer comes down, tens of millions will look to withdrawal their coins into self-custody. But they may not be able to. -- Unfortunately this risk does not seem to be top of mind in the current Core culture. One instance of a tone-deaf Core response to this kind of problem relates to CTV. As @JeremyRubin has been pointing out for years, CTV would be the most efficient way to guarantee that people can withdrawal coins from institutions in times of chain-panic and congestion, allowing exit to happen during crises without fully "unrolling" transactions. I wrote about this at length in 2023, and why it seems there is no more efficient way to do this (https://delvingbitcoin.org/t/thoughts-on-scaling-and-consensus-changes-2023/32#design-for-exit-5). And yet technical figureheads like @TheBlueMatt and @murchandamus downplay the value of CTV, claiming that it has no compelling uses. CTV is one of the primitive building blocks that we need to figure out UTXO scaling solutions. (Not to mention its use in applications like vaults.) Some Core devs might argue "well okay, maybe we need that functionality - but CTV isn't the right way to do it. We need to think harder!" The problem is that time is running out. As nation-states begin to enter the technical ecosystem, soft forks that promote scaling and self-custody will be more difficult to deploy. Powerful actors will not want bitcoin to change - they're perfectly happy letting regulated custodians act as the L2. As the market cap grows, the stakes of change go up, and it will be much harder to get economically relevant actors to run new consensus. Because Core devs aren't paying close attention to the covenants conversation, they may not realize that CTV is upgradeable, simple, and well-tested. It's good enough. This gap in understanding partially reveals that those devs prefer to work on more smaller self-contained puzzle problems that are more tractable. Maybe this is understandable given the fraught Core development process and historical drama of soft forks, but neither of those are an excuse for abandoning the core challenge of realizing bitcoin. -- Segwit and Taproot were massive changes, and I can almost understand why so much drama was spent on them. They both basically reinvented how locking scripts are stored and executed in bitcoin. But to make significant headway on finding a scaling solution for self-custody, it may only take a few opcodes - much more narrowly scoped bits of functionality. Changes that are much easier to test and reason about, and don't reinvent the engine of bitcoin. -- As I continue campaigning for a renewed focus on scaling coin ownership, some may compare me to the "big blockers" of the 2017 scaling wars. The big-blockers camp wanted to raise the blocksize for the sake of housing the world's P2P payments. They resisted the use of Lightning and other second layer solutions. The reality is that they have been partially vindicated. Lightning has not solved our problems, and given the on-chain footprint that existing channel constructions require, it categorically cannot. Lightning certainly helps reduce on-chain payment volume once someone has opened a channel - but to do that for most people will require a layer 1 innovation. I don't share the big blockers' objectives. I don't think that trying to fit the world's P2P payments on the base chain is a reasonable target. But the ability to resist near complete capture of UTXO custody by third-party financial institutions - *that* is intertwined with the core purpose of bitcoin. In Satoshi's whitepaper, the first sentence claims "A purely peer-to-peer version of electronic cash would allow online payments to be sent directly from one party to another without going through a financial institution." If most users become unable to even take possession of their own coins a few times a year, we have failed on the objective. -- I am not writing this out of any sense of antagonism. Yes, I am frustrated that after numerous attempts, Core devs are not engaging more productively with the few people trying to translate scaling strategies to the base layer. But I'm hoping that by calling attention to this issue, we can get some of these great minds to refocus on bitcoin's critical mission, and to realize that ossification will come sooner than we thought. The existing (and well-funded) power structures *want* stasis. The recent show of rapid institutional affinity should make you suspicious that bitcoin in its current form isn't a threat to the fiat order. The lack of "ivory tower" attendance in the recent OP_NEXT and the broader covenants discourse demonstrates that, like many of America's elite institutions, there has been mission drift in bitcoin's technical elite. I hope this changes. -- The risk of merging many of the opcodes proposed during the last few years is limited. OP_CAT, OP_CTV, lnhance, probably OP_CCV, some others; they're all fine. If sufficiently tested, great additions to bitcoin. We can pretty easily mitigate what risk there is with comprehensive testing and analysis, provided the focus is there. The upside is almost infinite: a reasonable attempt to continue the preservation of bitcoin's unique function - trustless self-custody that is practically available to most.
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No, it means a P2P. Equality of opportunity, not equality of outcome. There is no centralized party deciding who can and can’t be a peer. Bitcoin is not perfect. It’s good enough and the best we have.
If by live free you mean crush you with less capital... That's what living for money is all about you stupid scumbag
Of course it exists, what are you talking about? Anyone that wants to transact on-chain can do so at any time. The network is and will continue to be P2P. Show me an example of a peer of the network not being allowed or requiring permission to transact with another peer. The elephant in the room is that not everyone will end up being a peer. Bitcoin is scarce, blocks pace is scarce. This is not a new revelation.
Anyone can run the software and participate in the free market for scarce UTXOs and blocks pace. I’ll leave it there. We can agree to disagree on the outcomes we want and how to get there.