Replies (56)
Anyone who needs help on Robosats or privacy methods will get help for free, I have never charged for helping the sovereign expansion of Bitcoin.
My job has always been to fuck with the system.
View quoted note →How does 4 coordinators make it decentralized?
This is a war and as such we have to have a plan and be realistic.
- If you sell your bitcoin kyc to buy nokyc you will have to declare to the government the sale of it and you will pay taxes on it, which breaks my most sacred rule, never pay taxes on Bitcoin.
- For this better anonymize your stash so the government can't prove it's yours. Unfortunately KYC does not disappear but the tax burden does, usually between 5 and 10 years depending on country and amount “defrauded”. If the government asks you can claim that you sold it x years ago.
- As for the best methods to buy Bitcoin without kyc I discard the f2f in person in cash because of the physical danger involved, ATMs now in some countries in Europe ask for ID, from my point of view Robosats offers a good risk/reward system. On the other hand try to charge in Bitcoin for your services.
- Most important of all is to create a black market/circular economy in Bitcoin, I know many do not like the term black market, but the black market is not bad, it is just a market away from the collecting hand of the state.
It is not a censorship resistant p2p system, but until recently we only had one coordinator, now we have at least 4, it is not very different from the decentralization that Nostr can offer with relays, in this sense it is better Bisq.
Nostr is used for events or messages as JSON. It's different from using a coordinator to trade. Even noones.com has multiple moderators but that doesn't make it decentralized.
The aim of robosats is that if a coordinator goes down, the service will continue to function.
The coordinators are not related to each other either.
The orders are created randomly in the different coordinators (unless you choose it).
For that reason I think the architecture is quite similar to Nostr and relays.
physical danger can be mitigated. have a gun, smaller amounts, public places or even hire a bodyguard if you have to.
bigger problem is that you never know who the buyer is. it may be a cop, you are probably taped (surveillance is omnipresent) and you can't spend big amount of cash anyways.
black markets (and maybe proxy merchants) is the only way we win this war.
That‘s a trade-off that is necessary to enable fast trades. Your argument is totally valid, but for higher privacy, I would go for Bisq‘s Cash by Mail with a PO (ideally an anonymous one).
For everything else Robosats is perfectly fine.
lnp2pbot will evolve into mostro.network
I want to try Robosats. I've got KYC cash on Strike. Installed Zeus to receive lightning sats. Question is: how is the KYC broken when it moves out of Strike into Robosats? And if there are regular withdrawals from Strike to these random lighting addresses (Robosats) how will that not be deemed as purchases and spends that can be taxed?
I don't know how Strike works, but if Strike is Bitcoin with KYC, don't use it.
Use
@vexl 😎 and build the p2p network peer by peer…
It's where I started on lightning, but want to stop. On Robosats its my only option to buy. What other options to buy are recommended?
To buy without kyc, these are my favorites.
- Robosats (Lightning)
- Bisq (Onchain)
- lnp2pbot (Lightning)
kycnot.me
but which is a good payment method? don't want recommend IBAN or revolut
With the recent addition of Bitcoin Veneto, The Continental node is now directly connected to all 4 existing coordinators with channels of at least 5M, most with 0 fees (except TempleOfSats).
If you're a frequent user of #RoboSats opening a private channel to The Continental will allow you to trade on all 4 coordinators just one hop away. Just saying 😉
The RoboSats orderbook lives on nostr
Can I use it without a coordinator?
No, the coordinator is still needed to lock bonds and escrows
Can you explain how it’s private when for example Strike is used as a payment method? Is it simply because the exchange doesn’t know what the payment is for?
What it solves is not dependence on the coordinator model but rather the global market liquidity overview. Orderbooks can be made interoprable as is already the case for lnp2pbot. This helps prevent users from being screwed by closed platforms like peach where they pay 2% trade fees + high premium because they have no knowledge of global liquidity
I don't know strike, but except for the person you buy bitcoin from, no one knows what that payment from Fiat was for.
The stats for a lot better on robosats, and the premium (2,17%) is really god for non-KYC #Bitcoin.
That makes sense. I actually didn’t think about the person you buy the bitcoin from. So if a fiat payment is used, is there any personal information shared with the other party (e.g. first and last name)?
Correct, depending on the payment method some information is shared with the seller and vice versa but this is preferable to a centralized database where all your movements are so that they can be stolen or used by the government.
For sure. Thanks for taking the time. 🤙
0
p2p
Which is the best secure keyboard?
The one you don't use 😂 .
Exactly what I would like to know. Revolut is similar to Strike in that your ID is tied to your fiat. So how does buying on Robosats obfuscate the KYC trail?
How does it compare to
@peachbitcoin?
I do not know how peachbitcoin works
As on a FOSS keyboard?
Florisboard
OpenBoard
FUTO Keyboard (open source, locked to a proprietary license)
FUTO is my favorite because it comes with swype, spell check, and local on device sperch-to-text.
You can use FUTO's "Voice Input" speech-to-text with Florisboard.
I use it here 🤙
Is it really preferable for a random person to knowy our full name when we transact? I have looked into all of them but never used P2P for that very reason. Here in Sweden the moment you know my real name you instantly find where I live and many other details... It's easy for a bad actor to lurk around these p2p platforms, especially in countries like Sweden that you Google a person's name and you instantly get 20 different websites with address, birthday, cars, social security number etc...
That risk is up to you to assess. I would rather have a random user have the data of a small transaction than not the government know all the data of my transactions and force you to pay taxes, but I don't live in Sweden.
On the other hand it is also about buying and selling without permission.
I would love to be able to do that. It has happened multiple times for bitcoiners to be attacked at their home here in Sweden , so small or big transactions you are telling some random person that you hold bitcoin...
robosats doesn't support cash in mail. this is the only form of payment that doesn't actually require KYC end-to-end and if you want to do it you still have to use bisq/haveno
It does support it.
In fact, it supports any payment method.
Plus you can easily run your own instance of it like bisq if you wish.
Thanks for the post. Coordinators are the Achilles heel and #bisq doesn’t have coordinators if I remember correctly. Or maybe every participant is a coordinator?
Indeed bisq does not have coordinators but its use is more complex for novices and it does not support Lightning in its protocol with scrow.
My two favorites are Robosats and Bisq but it is difficult for me to recommend Bisq to newbies.
Sorry I understood email, you are right, it does not support this method because of the blocking times.
What's the benefit over RetoSwap?
you can send fiat on strike to another strike user and they send you kyc free Bitcoin
that user knows what you bought and they know your strike user name. strike knows you sent fiat to another user but can't be 100% certain on why
Is this functional in India?
Yes, it works with any payment method from any country, including altcoins or stable currencies, you just have to add it and find another participant that accepts it.
Someone I know recently posted a buy offer on RoboSats with 3% over market and it didn't get picked up and now they said they're sad
At 3% they are taken pretty quickly, I usually put them below the premium paid in the last 24 hours.
I recommend
@peachbitcoin as well. Onchain only for now. Not working in the US.
https://peachbitcoin.com/nl/referral?code=PRA13Ewhere do I find lnp2pbot? thx
