I don't mean to alarm anyone but someone just wrote a sha256 function for bitvm:
https://techmix.github.io/tapleaf-circuits/
I think this means we can validate merkle proofs now...which means we can also do 2WP sidechains now
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this increases the size of the largest program written for bitvm from ~300 logic gates to ~165,000 logic gates
btw I am still hoping someone will implement a gameboy for bitvm
a gameboy's processor only has ~3000 logic gates
and doom runs on gameboy
Sounds like fun times ahead π
Things are moving so quickly, it's insane. If true this is a major breakthrough. Bitcoin can't scale they said...
Well done. Another box ticked.
π
Amazing news. Do you have a clear concept yet of how that translates to applications like 2WPs yet, given that bitvm is currently a challenge response game between 2 participants, or are there still some gaps to fill in?
I would be deeply grateful if someone would explain the significance of this advance in a way that an interested and intelligent bystander might be able to begin to understand?ππ
this is amazing. When will 2wp be on main net?
Weβre living in the future.
Agreed. Please dumb down π
Idk enough to confirm much else, but I know a proper 2 way peg would mean trustless on & off ramps into sidechains.
It allows a huge new scope for sidechains to interact with the Bitcoin timechain. More options for people to build on while using bitcoin to secure it by locking them and using tokens associated to those coins. Big moves forward potentially for scaling
Good times basically π€
HO
LY
SHIT
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Fuu
There are still some gaps to fill. Robin wants to use this to create a federation which cannot steal your money as long as one of them is honest. Here is a design I think is close to working: the federation members would all act as verifiers who agree to challenge a prover (who holds all sidechain deposits) if he doesn't process withdrawal requests correctly.
As long as one of them does so honestly, that honest party could take the prover's money and distribute it to withdrawer's honestly if the prover does not do so.
If this design worked it would improve the trust assumptions of federated sidechains, which currently rely on an honest majority, so that instead they only rely on a single honest party -- which could be you. You could just be one of the verifiers, and then you only need to trust yourself (and bitcoin's standard trust assumptions, e.g. 51% of miners are not censoring your transactions)
Is it working at your end ? It just freezes when selecting SHA256, then "Choose this program". The other program options are working though.
Whatβs Bitvm? Been hearing it tossed around.
Yes it works for me but it takes like 5 minutes
It's a very big program and I can't believe my VM implementation can even handle it
(I don't think it would be able to handle a proper dispute)
It's a virtual computer that can run programs created as boolean logic circuits
What's cool about it is, these programs can be embedded into bitcoin addresses, so that anyone who sends money to a bitvm address can only spend it if they correctly run the program embedded into the address
And the program can theoretically be anything -- it could be Photoshop, or Doom, or a copy of the ethereum virtual machine, or anything. If a computer can run it, you can in theory convert it to work in bitvm, and then basically pay someone to run that program, or get them to put up some money as a pledge that they *will* run the program correctly, then take their money if they don't
Interesting, is there a BIP I can read about it?
Ok thanks. Will try again with a mood powerful setup. Great if wrinkles can be ironed out!
I can't wait to read the details on how this 2wp would work.
Will this lead to chain data bloat like Ordinals, NFTs on-chain? Got to keep it lean to encourage lots of modes, right?
Nah thatβs nothing to do with BitVM. Everything is explicitly off chain in that model.
Itβs inscriptions that are the horrible bloat storm in that regard. That said a better NFT system built with BitVM may take share away from inscriptions, which would be positive.
I'm hoping for Pokemon on Gameboy and then Doom π
I didn't understand everything, and certainly not the consequences hereof, but you should definately still read this thread...
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What is 2WP?
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functionally equivalent to a Turing complete programming environment?
We have doom in notepad.
Here's Paul Sztorc's response from telegram:
Paul Sztorc (beware impostor accounts):
Yeah but this only applies to the people who have sat down with each other when the chain started
New people can't join -- or if they do they are trusting the other original people
Also doesn't solve the lopsided fee problem
And, as always, 51% hash can steal via censorship -- but no strength in numbers effect for BitVM 2wp
So I doubt people will use BitVM for 2wp
Here's Paul Sztorc's response from telegram:
Paul Sztorc (beware impostor accounts):
Yeah but this only applies to the people who have sat down with each other when the chain started
New people can't join -- or if they do they are trusting the other original people
Also doesn't solve the lopsided fee problem
And, as always, 51% hash can steal via censorship -- but no strength in numbers effect for BitVM 2wp
So I doubt people will use BitVM for 2wp
Could OP_VAULT be recreated with bitvm?