Replies (93)
A lot of the notes I boost don't even show up on primal. I don't understand if they're censoring folks as some claim, or if it's that they don't allow cross relay promotion? It's a shame because I see that as the best way to discover new folks, and the attitude on the primal trending pages is super stale.
They need to be open to more talking points than just the Bitcoin influencers and the anti-zionists. It's hard enough to onboard normies without the toxic boys club on Primal.
Subscription me harder, daddy.
I bet they all have all of the streaming services too.
Lack of cross relay integration is clearly by design, imo. They just want what the Primal team, and what their influencers talk about, to trend. It's a client that strictly adheres to the attention-starved influencer mentality. Barely anything educational with little meaningful engagement.
Their entire ecosystem is ridiculous🤣...
I'm sorry. MOST of it. There are some primal users that I do enjoy following.
Yea I agree. They could at least get better influencers, the ones on primal trending seem like they mostly regurgitate Twitter outrage content and it's boring, like there's a reason I left legacy social media come on bring a fresh take.
@TheRupertDamnit they are dying out. The
@GitCitadel team is literally building tools and clients that the #primal team said could not be done. And I'm also seeing more and more complaints about them every day. I find it ironic (not to mention extremely funny) that the team with very little funding is slowly killing off the one with millions in VC funding.
I find it enriching and enboldening that the small guys are slowly winning.
This is why i love Jumble. The ability to choose content from one specific relay, at a time, is an essential feature for any Nostr client, imo.
mine and my wife's phone bill is $70 mo combined
seventy dollars? surely seven dollars, no?
you have to broadcast the note to the primal relay, boosting alone doesn't necessarily do this.
Yup now someone tell vitor that so he can stop breaking amethyst.
Ah! This is a nuance that I didn't understand previously, thank you for bringing it up! Would proper protocol be to boost and broadcast, or would just broadcasting it suffice?
Nope seventy for Primal pro.
That's a dumb rule.
wow. what are they shilling along with the sub to make it worth that?
Here. I reinstalled it just to show you how ridiculous this price is.
I left Amethyst awhile ago. Fun while it lasted🤷.
Nothing. They just need to please their VC masters if they want to continue to live in their tropical paradise.
lol I can have the same or more for less other than paying for a vanity "Legend" status.
meanwhile on #Amethyst...
Jumble is where it's at. At least, for the moment.
wow I did not know that there are people paying for the premium. what do you get from it? btw, what do you use as your mobile client?
boosting references the note on your list of kind 1 events to your relays, but broadcasting copies the event to your relays
nostr is dumb lol
Jumble is good, Cody did a good job, and people are building neat stuff on top of it. The latest builds of Amethyst too. No more missing notes, plus real decentralization, it's better than ever. Plus list support and way better video compression in the next version.
I think most apps will broadcast on a boost. YMMV depending on client of course.
That is dumb but good to know thank you 🤣
Hmm ok but as a client primal does not do this? Maybe it is primal which is dumb not just Nostr?
Does Amythest not do this? I get a variety of content on Amythest but if I can get more on Jumble I'd be tempted 🤔
Could be. I'm not sure as a avoid primal.
Amethyst pulls straight from the relays of who you follow, pretty much the polar opposite of primal. It doesn't do single relay browsing like jumble does though. They are the best two clients in my opinion, each have their strengths.
Hmm ok. I think it's time for me to figure out a wallet outside of primal then... I'm hosting an event next week and hope to onboard folks to Nostr but while I knew I didn't love primal I didn't realize it was that problematic.
Lots of folks use Rizful, it seems to be ok.
Amethyst just places all content from your follows into your feed.
Lol yep. They should probably let people know of that when onboarding instead of keeping it on the hush hush.
Ok good that's what I thought it did
Ok I will check this out
Amethyst just takes too damn long to load anything. Jumble loads everything in an instant: single relay-based feeds, pictures, videos, notifications. You name it.
Everytime i see someone with a primal address I'm hesitant to follow them😬.
Good luck at your event. I recommend trying Blink wallet or maybe Minibits.
Ok I will check these out too thank you!
I've not had that issue with Amethyst personally. Loads fast, even better for me since the outbox update. Could be I am on fast connections all the time, but even with Tor enabled for everything it seems pretty snappy.
I actually get that with jumble, a long wait sometimes when first opening the page, especially when viewing the following feed.
Lol 😂
I'm going to try it on my Linux box. (Jumble)
I just installed the Amethyst update. It's a little faster than before. Still can't compare to #jumble though.
Honestly, i find that kind of strange. cause i have a fairly weak connection in my house. Maybe you have too many relays?
I'd say my relays are fine, 3 each inbox and outbox. Lots of people followed my note for setting Amethyst relays up with good results.
Jumble and Amethyst work in the same way in the background fundamentally, full outbox where they connect to hundreds of relays for receiving & sending notes. I always just assumed it is browser over head, and jumble needing to pull in the initial load of notes.
Could be the browser (I run Jumble through Keychat) or maybe the relays you're using are too slow🤔. Idk.
My relay settings
It's the same on Keychat, Firefox or Chrome. Also it's the same relays on both apps, so I don't see that making much of a difference speed wise. If the relays were slow, it would affect both.
Browser apps are generally slower than native apps, there's just more overhead, it's the nature of the beast.
It's not a big deal, I prefer Amethyst on mobile anyways.
Cool
what's Keychat?
Amethyst now you automatically connect to every relay that's on a person's profile if you follow them. So if one npub got 1000 relays & you follow it now your just automatically connected to all those relays & you have to block the ones you don't want to be connected to manually. It causes global feed to load clunky that half the notes won't even load properly, notifications got worse since this big change & now theres bugs that still waiting on fixes for over 2 months now?
I have to switch between apps now just to see notes load properly. Half the time I look at my own profile from amethyst & not even 2/3rds of my notes load. Every other client you can see em all.
Oh that's very interesting! I don't know that I ever look at global so I haven't had that problem, but I can understand how it would be an issue!
The following feed can be quite slow, since it doesn’t just fetch from your own relay settings — it also pulls from the relays used by all the people you follow. I saw you’re following over 400 users, which could mean fetching from more than a hundred relays. I wouldn’t really recommend browsing the following feed with Jumble for now. Hopefully, in the future, there’ll be relays dedicated to serving following feeds.
Also, try not to include relays with write restrictions as your read relays — that could cause you to miss notifications when others mention you.
Can you implement something like the proxy relay setting in Amy? aggr.nostr.land works quite well, and I believe nostr.wine has a similar feed relay too.
As far as I know, aggr.nostr.land does plan to implement the outbox model, but it doesn’t seem to be finished yet. Once it is, I’d be happy to support it — that would significantly reduce performance overhead.
I suppose YMMV but it works well as a proxy in my personal testing so far.
@semisol what is the status?
I don't fully understand what you mean. Jumble allows users to choose feeds from individual relays. It's been doing fine with following feeds. Are you sayikg some posts from my follows won't show up in my chosen feeds?
Jumble is mainly designed for browsing content directly from a specific relay. Nowadays, there are special types of relays like community relays, curated relays, or language-based relays. When you browse these, it’s independent of who you follow — the data only comes from that single relay, which makes it much faster.
The following feed, on the other hand, fetches notes from the write relays set by all the users you follow. That means it needs to pull data from dozens or even hundreds of relays and then aggregate them, so it’s naturally much slower.
Thank you for clearing that up. So we need to do a better job at designating the different types of relays. Do community, curated, and language-based relays have a secure method of distinguishing read and write relays?
Honestly, there isn’t a reliable way to distinguish them right now, since the boundaries are quite blurry. Users still need to understand what each relay they use is for, which isn’t very user-friendly. The good news is that most relays today are unrestricted public ones.
The goal is that for broadcasts it will use outbox. For receiving, it scrapes all relays so that should be a solved problem.
But I am intending to add a proxy mode where it can AUTH proxy as well
You should support
@Jumble. The best Nostr client and with just one developer working on it and not full time, haha.
What are the features that are the most important on Primal Studio? I'm curious, and I'm actually writing something for my own team so that we don't have to pay $70/mo
Try
@YakiHonne — it’s fully decentralized, works with all Nostr clients, and lets you customize your relays and wallet in just one tap.
@Jumble much thanks to
@Cody for making a great client.
Enjoy it!
Just a minor bug, but sometimes it says users have 0 following.
I agree, and the team is very responsive, they often acted very well when we suggested improvements or reported issues.
I am using it also on my pc ☺️ ty
I use it in my mobile too ☺️ ty even writing this on #Yakihonne 👌
Which user?
lol
Random users. The bug comes and goes.
PRIMAL BLOWS
Lol #primal logged me out of Amber.
What do you think of adding local storage of notes specifically for the following feed + building the feed directly from the local storage + background syncing of new notes from follows from relays? Would you accept a patch for that?
This would be amazing.
Id really like that, one of the remaining features that keeps me on nostrudel is that with slow relay loading I don't have to sit and wait for my notes to load every time I refresh the page (which is often enough to be annoying). I didn't realize that jumble lacked this feature until I started trying to use it more regularly.
Could just be me, with privacy browsers, dns, being blocked by cloudflare, and privacy blocking extensions apps get buggy for me really fast so I often have to reload the page just to make sure im seeing things,
I think I'm pulling and caching every 2 minutes, or so, to keep it from getting stale.
It's incredibly tedious switching over, tho. Took me all day and I have to test over and over.
Do you find yourself running into any data consistency or performance issues?
Wait so you just "caching" events in a javascript Map type just in memory? In that case yeah something more persistent would be nice! My issue is reloads, then relays start to throttle/rate limit as well and the experience starts to get worse in a hurry. It's a web app, Im gonna refresh it, open and close it pretty often.
I close or unload my tabs when I'm not actively using them.
That would definitely make the experience better, but I’m not sure if it’s the right approach for a web client. Still, it’s worth trying
I guess it’s caused by query timeouts. This issue is more common when browsing the following feed, because when there are too many concurrent long connections, the browser blocks new ones. That can lead to some queries timing out — not just the follower count.
It's gone now🤷
