Now do non canonical

Next is actually already queued up. I want to check out the Scofield translation, as I'm suspicious of these modern translations pushing an agenda.

Highly speculative and even if true not super impactful to the narrative. What far less speculative is the Greek mystery religions influence upon Christianity. I would highly recommended investigation. Christmas? Easter? Sunday? Constantine?

Which translation did you read? How do you square being uncomfortable with much of what you read with having more faith at the end?

NASB2020. That's a tricky question to answer. It's definitely not all bad. And I'm super skeptical of bias in translation. There is so much interconnectedness to the Bible and much can be learned from the Bible and applied to modern day happenings. Being that I read the work chronologically (down to the verse) I would jump between different books, written by different people across time, writing the same or similar things strengthened my conviction that events likely actually happened as documented. When read through the eyes of someone knowledgeable of pole shift and the growing field of study that has become, I see documented evidence of what I've been learning. It is veiled to some degree, which I'm suspicious of being translation error (intentional or otherwise) or possible limits of language complexity, IDK. Do I have a bias looking for pole shift evidence? Absolutely. But being able to tie modern scientific study to teachings within the most shared, copied, read, and translated work in human history (that we know of) isn't by accident. What I think is happening and what I think is going to happen is more than a passing mention in the most popular faith works of the past millennia. I've always had this mental tug of war between science and faith, but they aren't competing. They're complimentary. Going through this study helped clarify that.

I was curious because as an atheist it struck me as odd to see a self professed Christian admit that there are parts of the Bible that are a bit rough to modern moral sensibilities. I have read the bible, KJV. I imagine you were wondering. That's probably one of the things Christians find most annoying about me. Einstein never said that, frequent misattribution. While he did admit to believing in god, he was clear it was not the Christian god. It was closer to a worship of the idea of a grand unifying theory of physics.

Apocrypha Now is hilarious and informative. I often recommend God Is Disappointed In You to Christians. It is an excellent insight into what non believers see when they read the Bible.

I suspect that what has become the Bible was not necessarily the original intent--at least for some of the books/chapters. For example, names and ancestry tree wouldn't be important (IMO) for what is otherwise a sacred religious text to millions. The nuance that Einstein mentions in actual work is interesting to me. I suspect humans personify the concept of God more than what reality may actually be (for believers) because that's what's comprehensible and comfortable. Flexibility in thought is warranted IMO regarding the definition of God, The Creator of the Universe. I also can't rule out His ability to shape shift--i.e. "when in Rome... When on Earth..."

Its one of my biggest annoyances to see Christians say "culture" as a disclaimable dog whistle for racism. Their religion and its people have a long history of willfully destroying other peoples culture to the point that many people's history is almost completely lost. Of course now we must freeze time and defend the one true culture, white American 1950s Christianity. It isn't just brown people either. There are only 3 books about Norse mythology that survived from that time and 1 of them was written by a Muslim trader.

Suffice it to say, I'm a firm believer that faith/religion is personal to the individual rather than institutionally defined.

It sounds like you are closer to the esoterics or gnostics than the average American Christian today. If I came to believe in the supernatural today, one of the esoterics is probably where I'd land. I'd buy the Christian god being a false god and great deceiver before I'd buy that he was true and good. Interestingly the false god narrative is also why so many atheist groups use the imagery of Satan. If you see the Christian god as an evil deceiver the Satan of the bible becomes a hero who stood up to the evil power and was slandered away into martyrdom.

Awoke with a thought about original intent and ancestries being in the Bible. Ancestry is in the Bible because Judaism was exclusive based on kinship. So that makes parentage as key to proper participation as not eating shellfish. It is just another set of rules. Don't lie, be related to one of these people, no cheeseburgers, and so on. That all checks out, except that my recollection is that the geneological records from the Bible are patrilineal. The rules are very clear that being Jewish is matrilineal. @Comte de Sats Germain any thoughts on that one?

Originally anyone could convert to Judaism. Err, by originally, I mean for a few hundred years after Moses. At some point they got legalistic, and distorted the law/covenant. The original covenant is precisely the same as the current covenant, which is only honored by Christians - judge not, love your neighbor. The reason Judaism changed is also the same reason Christianity has undergone its own changes - power. Ever notice how baked into their (both) beliefs power is? Its always the same process. Purity tests : you're not one of us unless you believe/perform this extreme thing ; or some other invented legalism meant to exclude. In the Old Testament, this caused the Israelites to become idolaters over and over. Ezekiel, Isaiah, the exile - all because of idolatry. Idolatry is worshipping images. Law is an image. Materialism is equally an image. I've heard speculation that the genealogies aren't as ancient as they appear, that they were inserted for the purpose of deriving kingly legitimacy. Idk. I only listen to experts, I'm not one myself. I think it makes sense. Who was writing, and who was reading? Not regular people, they were illiterate. Anyways, I could've skipped all this and just said that matrilineal Judaism is a post-diaspora invention, but... I enjoy my verbosity.

Most of the bible is fabricated in ways that would offend modern sensibilities. I say that as a Christian, and I don't care if the whole crowd of pious imbeciles disagree. It was written by men, edited by men, whole sections added and removed, it plagiarizes other religions in some parts (especially Genesis), and then on top of all that, its not even understood, so what was writing all that even for...? We don't need the OT at all, and its totally illogical to begin with. The NT is as fabricated as anyone could dare to imagine. Most of it was only even written as a response to Marcion's "heresy" - which, depending on who you ask could be anything, but it appears to me his real crime was putting a bunch of texts together into a Bible. Marcion did a bible, oh no, gotta do another bible to refute Marcion... Only maybe 1/3 of Paul's epistles can be linked to previous writing, and even that is still not source material. It doesn't serve anyone to pretend this isn't the case. You can't be "more Christian" than another, in any case, but certainly not by believing falsehoods that masquerade as piety.

That's why I tagged you for your opinion out of all of nostrs self professed Christians. I usually unfollow people who start posting religious content regularly and you are permitted by far the most religious posts of anyone I follow. I think you are genuinely looking to be a better person. Most of the religious content I see is virtue signaling in group status, not exploring personal bettering in any way. Jesus took issue with public displays of piety but people are still out here using their social media to blast out "look how much I love Jesus" without a hint of irony.

There's a lot of ways this could branch off... Many of the original Christians believed the Old Testament god was/is the demiurge, and the New Testament god is the true God. IMO, the demiurge is really us. The book of Job is interesting in how it deals with the concept of Satan. "Satan" is a word, not a person, and it means adversary. Job asks God why he has become a Satan to him, and then God has a prideful hissy fit. That's clearly not the Father... So, it appears that the demiurge and "Satan" may be the same entity. Given how widespread beliefs like this were in the 300 years before the state church reared its beastly head out of the sea, and how utterly antithetical the state church was to Jesus' teachings - the mass murders it committed and the legalism and the idolatry and the twisting of everything into a justification for state violence - it seems quite likely that Christianity was hijacked by Jews, and they've been controlling it ever since.

Thank you! Hold me to it - if I ever start those "look at me!" pious displays, be as rude as you need to be, and knock some sense back into me.

do you have an alternative moral code? maybe a first principle of morality? or is "better person" just some reddit teir group think morals.

Do you have any history with any of the other people in this thread? To me you look like an asshole stranger who dropped in on a friendly conversation to lob insults. Since you are shitting on every position taken it really doesn't help your case. If you want to participate read the vibe and adjust. Continue on how you are and I'm going to block you.

ok reddit

millennial slop

Can you explain why you Markoff chain insult generator bots think reddit is such a great insult? Every 3rd insult mentions reddit like its your home base and you can't generate text strings more than 10 words long without it.

because it is a meme that is understood outside of the reddit cult within internet spaces

Pseudo-intellectual, overly logical arguments.... Certain stereotypical traits (atheism debates, tech bro culture, “nice guy” energy, etc.)

Never been a Reddit person. You make it sound a lot nicer than wherever you got the idea that being dumb and rude is a good idea.

you don't have to be on reddit to embody reddit... “Statistically speaking, romantic relationships are inefficient compared to maximizing individual productivity. And personally, as an atheist, I don’t see a point to the religious institution of marriage. It’s just a socially constructed contract designed to regulate inheritance and reproduction. Long-term pair bonding seems more like cultural conditioning than rational choice.”

for example https://www.lesswrong.com/ is also an embodiment of the reddit meme

You know nothing about me. Which is why you should slow your roll and learn. The context here before you was questions and information sharing. If you think every place is a place for insults and closed mindedness you are going to stay this dumb forever.

#💎

I'm sorry thinking offends you so much. We were thinking here. I'm inviting you to go some place you'll be more comfortable.

I can't see what the other guy's saying, but your (Bill) responses are golden

AKtuAlly we where engaging in rationality.... I open-mindedly insult Aktually. your the one getting but hurt.

this hole thread is your butt hurt deflection from my question because your a nice guy reddit guy

"where being kind and engaging in the Socratic rational method. why have you been so mean???" oh stfu and get on with the conversation

or dont

You were sarcastic and insulting to a total stranger unprovoked right out of the gate. I don't owe you an answer to anything. I don't see any benefit to me to trying to teach a self proclaimed anti intellectual. This WHOLE, meaning entire not HOLE meaning opening, thread has been you repeatedly insulting me for not being as dumb or rude as you. Spoiler, I'm not insulted. I don't know where you learned whatever definition of rationality you are using, but it doesn't mean drive by insulting strangers in any book I've read. Perhaps if you read some books you wouldn't be struggling so much with these common words?

welcome to the uncensored internet. call the mods to come arrest me for unwarranted drive by insults. if you didn't intent to respond then why do you continue to engage

"Thanks for sharing your perspective! It’s always interesting to see how different interpretations can lead to varied conversations. Wishing you all the best on your journey of understanding! 📚✨"

are you attempting to reform my typing and make me "nice" or do you expect an apology lmao

Perhaps I should wait for your 4 follow up posts before I respond? You seem to be struggling to collect your thoughts. I never asked for any help here. I'm an adult. No mods needed. If you think going around insulting strangers and then demanding they help you is smart I think you need to get off the internet and be welcomed into the real world.

"I’m not sure where the assumption is coming from, but I wasn’t demanding help from you or asking for moderation. I responded to what was said, just like you did. That’s kind of how public discussions work. If my tone came across differently than intended, that wasn’t me “struggling to collect my thoughts.” Sometimes written conversations lose nuance, and things can read sharper than they’re meant to. That doesn’t automatically mean someone is flailing or needs supervision. I also don’t think it’s fair to frame disagreement as “insulting strangers.” Disagreeing with someone’s point isn’t the same as attacking them as a person. If something specific I said felt insulting, I’m open to clarifying it — but broad character judgments don’t really move the conversation forward. I’m an adult too, and I don’t need rescuing or moderating. I’m capable of having a discussion without it turning into a referendum on my ability to function in the “real world.” Let’s keep it about the actual topic rather than each other. If you’d rather disengage, that’s completely fine. No hard feelings on my end."

I knew you couldn't do just one response. I hold no delusion that you are capable of personal growth. I already told you I don't value your opinions so an apology would mean nothing to me.

Maybe you prefer typing to chat gpt lmao

And now I can't see his responses either.