SWAN WAS USAID FOR BITCOIN INFLUENCERS.
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NO ONE KNOWS WHAT USAID IS
WE STACK SATS AND STAY HUMBLE
COINKITE *IS* AIDS
I tried to warn people about them
kind: burn 🔥
😂😂
lolllll
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Bro you are part of this, such a slimeball you are.
https://ten31.vc/home#portfolio
Scroll down swan is in there.
#BREAKING: Swan will publish quarterly “Proof of Lawsuits” to increase transparency regarding how many lawsuits they’re involved in.
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I was going to use Swan but kept procrastinating.
Rug pulled from Open Source to not open source once they got market share.
Well that explains why they wouldn’t hire me. They don’t like big balls. 😎
😂 😂 😂 😂 😂
This is a bullshit breakdown of what actually happened / inserting bias that didn't exist when this shit all went down.
You got one thing right, NVK is petty.
Most manlets are.
what didn't they do?
No, they were funded by Odell & Marty.
Bro you are part of this, such a slimeball you are.
https://ten31.vc/home#portfolio
Scroll down swan is in there.
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They addressed this on air already.
you were one of their earliest investors...why shit on them now
THEY DO BUSINESS ON AIR BETTER THAN ANYONE
It sure seems that way to me now.
Slimeballs always need to excuses for themselves.
Oops I meant VCs**.
Me, a victim?
No, people who bought it and continue to buy it under the guisse of Open Source who still don't know that is the case.
A lot of people are still surprised by this.
Banger 💥
Ouch 😎
Backfire
SO WHY YOU INVESTED IN SWAN?
Gotcha so selling your shares then now you know what they are?
Aren't they still OSS, just without an F? Saying, that not being FOSS, so others wouldn't profit from their work?
Probably better to cut ties completely is they truely are what you say they are.
THAT WOULD REQUIRE A BUYER.
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t Y*
Swan won’t buy them back? They probably don’t want an investor that is calling them out? Maybe in both your interests to work out a deal? Mind you im not in private equity so no idea how that shit works.
EXACTLY. DUDE TRIED LEECHING OFF PPL'S MORTGAGES AT ONE POINT 🤡
👀👀
No FOSS just means Free AND Open Source,
OSS = Open Source
Coldcard ≠ OSS
Coldcard = Source Viewable
tecosystems
Tragedy of the Commons Clause
For those who would develop software and sell it, open source is something of a conundrum. On the one hand, as Mike Olson has noted, you can’...
Free and open source means the software is being offered for free.
A lot of times software packages and they're inherent future releases are part of a paid for package even if it's Open Source.
Common mistake.
What is your recommendation?
😂
It's seems to be over my head. If I see a code of a product, it's viewable, source verifiable, but not OSS? If I can take the code and use it for other things, it's FOSS? But what is OSS without an F? OpenSource software is..? Must be free to use and change to be called OSS?
OSS = you can use it for other things
FOSS = you can download for free
Source Viewable/Verifiable = you'll get sued if you use it for other things
if you prefer to use a fully FOSS signing device, the choices are seedsigner or Jade/Jade Plus AFAIK
SeedSigner
Bitbox
Foundation Passport
Trezor
All are Open Source.
That explains everything. Appreciate your time!
Really recommending trezor and foundation over coinkite?
Both cater to shitcoiners and foundation got their start by ripping off coinkite code which to my understanding is why coinkite is no longer open source which is your entire argument against them
Foundation did not rip anyone off,
Coinkite did the same thing to trezor - it's called open source for a reason lol.
I'm recommending you use Open Source products as that is the future you wanna see and the present you want to be in.
Open Source devs find bugs in code all the time, which they did find really bad ones in Coldcard in the past.
Now you don't have that luxury because coinkite also has a reputation for not paying bounties.
For the shitcoin part,
That is highly irrelevant as Trezor is the oldest, meaning the most reviewed Bitcoin Hardware Wallet Source Code out there.
You'd be a fool to dismiss it with respect to prepackaged HWWs.
I personally am a SeedSigner maxi, if you build it yourself.
+1 achually 5++
diy SS*/*
To each their own…
foundation definitely did some shady shit when they were launching and I have had a bad taste ever since. This was reinforced when they partnered with cake wallet…
I love my coinkite stuff. Also do not rely solely on them
Multi vendor multi sig setup is my way to mitigate a lot of concerns you have with coinkite products
Do you man,
Foundation isn't shady for using open source code thats just fucking ridiculous 🤣.
Trezor team had to come out publicly and show people how Coinkite took their code for Coldcard and tried to pass it off as if they wrote the code.
That really happened, you just probably weren't around at the time.
I don’t consider it ethical to take someone else’s code (open source or closed source) to spin up a direct competitor and profit from the original’s authors work
IMO not much different than Chinese companies stealing IP/trade secrets from American companies to make cheap knock-offs
You don't believe in open source anon?
You have any info you can share on this? It was before my time.
Wasted a lot of time in the shitcoin casino from 2017 to 2020 before gaining an understanding of bitcoin during COVID
@ODELL @DETERMINISTIC OPTIMISM 🌞 thoughts?
This is the reason I have never bought a Coldcard never sat right with me that they benefited from FOSS by using Trezor code but then it’s not ok if people use their code. Hypocrisy is a big turn off.
Why do you still reply to my notes?
You are an ignorant hateful scumbag. I have no interest engaging with you.
Keep blaming all of the worlds problems on Jews
Insane to think you just asked these two slimeballs to give you an unbiased take 🤣
This is not what happened,
You're parroting influencers and NVK.
Tag someone else you think I should hear from…
Why is @ODELL a slimeball?
Wait so what Coinkite did to Trezor was unethical too then right?
He plays all sides with his hand in the cookie jar.
@ShiShi21m also need to note that instead of providing evidence for your claims which I explicitly asked for you threw shade on others
I have provided evidence 100x over the years, I just don't have a Twitter account to go searching for the screenshots again.
Go look for it yourself.
Here you go man, you're welcome.
Waiting for evidence showing that coinkite did the same thing to trezor as what foundation did to coinkite. @ShiShi21m isn’t providing anything though
If someone can show me some evidence that coinkite explicitly ripped off trezor I am happy to admit they got their start in an unethical manner
Again have not seen any actual evidence…
Stop waiting and go do some research of your own.
Yea honestly thought it was pretty common knowledge for anyone that’s been in the space for more than a year or two.
Look, you don't have to believe me.
Either way you're supporting a paradigm of government enforced licenses with respect to Bitcoin self custody.
Go cuck to the state with daddy NVK, each person chooses their path.
I mean your comparing apples to oranges 😂
Coinkite leveraged trezors open source code and then modified the code to create a better device with a secure element.
Meanwhile foundation took Coinkite code and created an almost identical product
I like Bitaxe’s model. Bitaxe (Skot) receives opensats grant, they publish the Bitaxe schematic, you can manufacture Bitaxes, then you can kick back Skot what you like.
Lots of Bitcoiners have enough resources to just let everyone in the community work together and benefit. This enables us to scale super fast with passionate people. I don’t like the whole, I-made-it-I-control-everything-about-it-and-every-iteration-that-comes-from-it, mentality.
Imagine some dude who slid 12 text-punched washers onto a stainless steel bolt started to try and license everyone making fireproof tubes with imprinted seed phrases.
I don’t consider what coinkite did to trezor to be comparable to what foundation did
Coinkite created a different device with a secure element which trezor than adopted years later after throwing shade on secure elements…
Foundation created a near identical device as the cold card
Bro I'm sorry but this is disgusting and disingenuous.
I can't continue this conversation as it seems like your bias is controlling the narrative for you.
Good luck do what you want.
Exactly,
NVK is super wealthy already - just a money hungry manlet.
I’m honestly trying to understand your position here and learn
The Twitter screenshot didn’t do it for me and I explained my logic
I don’t give a shit about licenses and governments.
I support coinkite because they make quality products and I consider them good actors in the space
Meanwhile this exchange started with you endorsing “open source” companies like trezor and foundation which I consider bad actors
I agree FOSS benefits the entire ecosystem since people can build and iterate off each other’s collective work.
The point I was making is that someone was calling Foundations unethical for using Coinkite code when it was FOSS before they changed it to source viewable. But Coinkite literally used Trezor code. So if you think Foundations is unethical then by default you would have to think Coinkite is unethical too since they did the same to Trezor.
Shouldn’t be any double standards.
They used a lot of Trezor code for cryptography etc. 
Go use licensed products,
I will not.
I personally will not use products from a company that:
- Actively tries to harm the ecosystem
- Spreads misinformation about their competitors
- Has fake discounts on their website that last forever and huge markups
- Offers products intentionally designed to turn into e-waste
Come on…”disgusting and disingenuous”?
We all have biases.
Maybe your allegiances to seedsigner and @DETERMINISTIC OPTIMISM 🌞 negative comments towards that product could be creating some biases on your side?
Bruh I literally listed multiple vendors bc I'm not biased.
When Coldcard was Open source I recommended them too.
Go use licensed products, I will not & yes your takes are not genuine.
Oh also they sell products with insecure SEs.
if I recall correctly they c/p the repos and didnt even change the names.
which is not to say that both CK and Foundation didnt do a lot of work,
they totally did.
this is how FOSS works and its why it makes it a robust model.
nvk doesn't understand that or doesn't care or whatever.
A second a go you didn’t even know they used trezor code now you claim it’s not comparable because they added a secure element? So in the last 5 minutes you became an expert in what changes made it ok for coinkite and not ok for foundation?
Interesting take
🤣
oh yeah that was it
the c/p the repos and then went back and changed the names so they weren't identical...
just kinda sleazy
NVK bad faith attacks seedsigner constantly. Odell does a much better job of explaining the shortcomings of seedsigner without the bad faith, but still with some bias. as someone who respects and appreciates his input, it'd be much simpler if he let his "superior products" win on their own merit, rather than attack a great FOSS project.
😵💫
It’s comical that you guys throw at coinkite for this but then endorse a company like foundation
I mean it’s fine being an open source maximalist that do not believe in people building businesses with licensing protections but don’t endorse some shady ripoff like foundation because they are “open source”
I agree with this criticism.
I don’t love the antics nvk uses against his competitors but also respect the products his company produces and still think they do it better than most
I would argue that nvk criticizes the hardware that seedsigner is using to build more than seedsigner itself though
Foundation isnt "open source"
theyre Open Source.
whereas CK and nvk like to grift as if they were Open Source
but they're "open source"
its dishonest and reprehensible.
and bitcoiners should insist on a completely Foss hww if its going to considered a flagship standard product.
Again comical to me that you will endorse a company like foundation for being Open Source while ignoring how they got their start and partnerships with shitcoiners
Fun thread to engage with today. Appreciate everyone’s thoughts and opinions
but NVK copies Trezor code and makes a product
and when other people do the same to him,
he changes the license and starts calling them commies 🤡
tell me you dont understand open source software without telling me...
so what do you recommend?
Rules for thee
Not for me
I see it differently and also know I have biases being a loyal coinkite customer. I think you guys need to check your biases especially as they pertain to foundation. I would have less to say if you guys didn’t endorse those shitheads
Nvk leveraged trezors open source software and built a better device with a secure element (trezor refused to add a secure element then attacked the concept until they folded and integrated into their devices)
Foundation ripped off coinkite’s open source code to create an almost identical ripoff which is why coinkite switched licenses
May not be an open source expert like you guys but I think I have a good understanding of the facts here
He understands,
Money hungry that is all.
Mental gymnastics are pretty incredible here
It is now bad to build a business that makes money?
Nvk leveraged trezor open source code to build a better product with a secure element.
Coldcard was open source until some shitty company you guys continue to endorse decided they would ripoff open source code to build an almost identical product with no real improvements
No one said that,
He built his entire market share and word of mouth sales from the Open Source community.
He's a money hungry tyrant manlet who wasn't loved enough as a child.
It’s not an endorsement, use whoever the fuck you want but calling foundations an identical rip off while in the same breathe praising Coldcard when they did they same is lame. If it’s shitty for foundations to do its shitty for Coldcard to do. If it’s not shitty for Coldcard to do then it’s not shitty for foundations. I have no allegiance to foundations the example is purely because they used the code from Coldcard the same way as Coldcard did to Trezor that fact you can’t see that is concerning.
Would respect your criticism a lot more if you had the same things to say about foundation
Pretty telling you endorse them but trash coinkite
I feel like I’m the twilight zone now
How are you not understanding why I feel differently about what the two companies did?
Coinkite added a secure element and allowed Airgapped functionality with PSBT support. Massive improvements over trezors offerings at the time
Did foundation improve anything?
I feel differently because I think coinkite leveraged open source code as it was intended and improved upon the original code. I haven’t seen any evidence that foundation did anything to improve the coinkite code they stole
QR signing wasnt an innovation on top of Coldcard????
Are you this much of a dumbcunt?!
He also stated QR signing was insecure, lied about it, and then made his own QR signing device.
QR signing was invented by Specter, then actually implemented by SeedSigner then used by Foundation with an SE.
Btw NVK then had to admit QR signing was as secure as using a new SD card for every transaction using the coldcard.
He then added NFC !!!! Lmao the most insecure method in the world!!!!!
I ENDORSE ALL OPEN SOURCE HWWS.
WHAT DONT YOU UNDERSTAND?!
MY OFFICIAL ENDORSEMENT ONLY GOES TO SEEDSIGNER BECAUSE ITS THE ONLY DEVICE THAT ISNT PACKAGED BEFOREHAND BY HUMANS TO USE WITH YOUR BITCOINS.
GFY 🙏🖖🫂
Are the raspberry pi’s you run the seedsigner software on open source?
Are you saying coldcard can’t be trusted?
OMG you really are a dumbcunt wow.
*TAKES THE CONVERSATION ANYWHERE TO SOOTH EGO*
How's your secure element? Not open source buddy lmfao.
I’m not the open source maximalist here that is throwing shade at everyone else…
Also not calling people dumbcunts either
Have a great rest of your day sir! I enjoyed the interaction
Sucks I have to switch clients to see all the replies
Apologies for the delayed response.
I never claimed that coinkite didn’t leverage trezor code. I claimed I never heard that coinkite did the same thing to trezor as what foundation did to coinkite and I still stand by that statement after all these exchanges…
Yalla Habibi 🤝🙏🫂
You still haven’t fixed your zaps yet? 😆
I'm saying we don't want to live in a world where government licenses are wielded against Bitcoin companies & individuals.
tecosystems
Tragedy of the Commons Clause
For those who would develop software and sell it, open source is something of a conundrum. On the one hand, as Mike Olson has noted, you can’...
Trezor sells bitcoin only wallets and states that that’s the best option for security if you only want to hold bitcoin.
Literally the entire fucking point of open source is that you rip off others and they rip off you. That’s literally the whole fucking point.
I have a Trezor and want a Foundation. I have never and will never consider a coinkite.
A Passport is significantly higher quality than a Coldcard.
Literally the entire point of open source is that people can use your code.
Is System76 shit for using Ubuntu to make Pop!OS? It was intended to be copied.
How so?
Could say as well - OSS, FOSS, NVKSS
🤣🤣🤣