Thread

nostr:nprofile1qqsvfr3f7p95stxqrjslnmuvsmhcxxxqt8swjdfjx5tz7zq0yms5cygpzemhxw309a6k6cnjv4kzumr0vdskcw358q6rsqg4waehxw309ajkgetw9ehx7um5wghxcctwvsxwhevn ,That depends entirely on how you define 'real.' If 'real capitalism' means zero state intervention, zero central banking, and zero cronyism, then you are absolutely right.💯 But does human nature and the inherent push for power/monopoly mean 'real capitalism' is fundamentally impossible to maintain in the real world? nostr:nevent1qqsgjp3zftk2mkmpazzj8svspdqj0r5sw3pc6e85yz9r7ejfl3xus2qpz3mhxue69uhkummnw3ezummcw3ezuer9wcpzp3yw98cykjpvcqw2r7003jrwlqcccpv7p6f4xg63vtcgpunwznq3qvzqqqqqqydradeh

If we are proposing this should everyone start with the same amount of Monopoly money?

If you mean pure, non-crony, Laissez-faire capitalism—you're right. Every system we have is a mixed economy, where politics inevitably captures the capital. We're running on 'Cronyism with Capitalist Characteristics.' 🤷‍♂️

Many socialists too would say, that real socialism has never been tried. But the issue seems to be more about centralization rather than capitalism vs socialism. I think there's an inherent trait in humanities' mentality, that leads it to centralization, to look for leaders etc. And I honestly am not sure how this is easily overcome.

Very early American colonies tried it and it worked spectacularly for a while after failed communal model failed miserably. Check YouTube for “The real story of Thanksgiving by Rush Limbaugh. It was an annual tradition on his show. Brought tears to my eyes when he taught it! https://youtu.be/jAyvTCaoFA0?si=lPXoXiZBhtMVYhnR

I agree with your take, yet I also think that these things are implemented in degrees, where each choice leads societies closer to socialism or to capitalism. Quick example: capitalism rests on the free market principle where prices are free to move wherever demand and supply bring them to. This is not currently happening with the most important price: interest rates are determined by the central banks. We can conclude that in this respect we're not closer to capitalism. I wanted to propose this example since too often we hear that "X has not been really tried" and it seems like a mischaracterization of how complex systems work.

Yep, I cannot disagree, but the problem still seems to be born of the tendency towards centralization. "Central banks"

That's obviously true, but what drives it? My take is that there is a fundamental difference in approach towards uncertainty. Socialism wants to plan and control everything. It literally fears unknown dynamics. Capitalism embraces uncertainty and places its trust on the naturally emerging behavior of groups and individuals.

real capitalism is about freedom, it must be fought for everyday

I’d say underground / unregulated / black markets are closer to real capitalism than this cantillion shitshow we have

Here's the problem for me with making war on such vocabulary, it is that these words mean very different things to different people. When I was younger (70s/early 80s) socialism meant the common man against vested interests. Now it seems to mean enforcing dogmatic concepts like transgernderism, and is often equated in the minds of north Americans with Marxism, and by extension Bolshevism. Same with capitalism in the minds of its opponents, it is equated with corporate power and centralization (crony capitalism), which I am sure is not what you are describing (I think capitalism and the drive to "capitalise" are an inate human characteristic). So we end up in this war denouncing "socialism" or "capitalism" when I actually think the problem is much deeper. Sorry, I do not have answers to solve this, I just like questioning things.

A couple of places got close and got rich because of it but I couldn't point to an actual AnCapistan

And that hateful system is what people are all to eager to believe to be actual capitalism, where only the politically connected may get and stay ahead while everyone else is condemned to lifelong poverty.

While that would certainly be an interesting experiment, I don't think it'd be necessary or even feasible without world-shattering violence. In a theoretical capitalist society, everyone ought to rise close to the level of his competence, rather than fail upwards through political connections or bureaucratic requirements, leaving behind and living off those able to provide for themselves.

I see what you did there

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This is capiralism, it ia just similar to communism