Replies (19)
Such an amazing feature. Now way easier to use!
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When I heard this word “ wasabi”
I remembered that green sauce , kind sauce that make your tongue burn and your nose felt hot .. cause spicy but it left you wanting more if you dip
In with the sushi 🍣
how can I measure the entropy of a CJ before doing it?
You can't.
Wabisabi coinjoin are too large to calculate (or even estimate) entropy.
You'd create a black hole before the calculation completes.
well that's a problem isn't it
Why?
well hang on
do you mean "the entropy is guaranteed to be so vast as to be incalculable"
and if so, can we verify that guarantee?
Yes.
Did you ever try opening a wabisabi round with a Boltzman tool? It either says "N/A" or it just crashes.
Entropy is never guaranteed
i mean
a tool crashing isnt precisely a guarentee 😂
my point is just that end users should be able to verify their privacy gains before using whatever tool
idk, how could the end user verify the quality of RSA 512 bit keys?
Entropy is the average uncertainty and we can trust averages to be average
idk, try and factor them?
so it IS "trust me bro" in that same way.
in that the end user relies in the implementation and theory and can't independently verify.
it does seem like a problem to me in the case of smaller projects.
tldr, what you think is a bug, is actually a feature.
Here the long answer:
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Security relies on min-entropy, not Shannon entropy. Min-entropy bounds the worst case: the probability of the *most likely* interpretation, not the average.
Since H_min ≤ H_Shannon, proving high Shannon entropy guarantees even the adversary's best guess has astronomically low probability. We're not trusting averages, we're using the average as an upper bound on the maximum.
Thanks for the detailed explanation. I was just addressing the obvious misunderstanding of what entropy is.
excited to read it 🙏
oh I see now why you're making the point about minimum entropy
this totally answers my question.
feature not a bug, as you say 🙏
Honestly the instances of ppl getting robbed of their bitcoin were caused by social engineering rather then technical problems...
