"You can always spend or exchange a dollar freely. But that doesn’t hold true for Bitcoin, and Silent Payments does not address that." Its quite the opposite bitcoin is fungible fiat is not. Bitcoin censorship resistance work fine. No one can stop your transaction. If they try eg miner ofac address censorship you just bump the fees and wait. Fungibility is core to Bitcoin's design.

A dollar is guaranteed legal tender at every bank, every exchange, every place you can go with it. Exchange accounts are frozen and funds are seized based on Bitcoin ledger history all the time. Retailers will also freeze Bitcoin coming from tainted sources. The fact that there is a concept of “tainted coins” means that Bitcoin is not fungible. Just because something may be used equivalently *in one place*, *in one manner* does not mean it is fungible. Fungibility requires it be able to be spent everywhere with the same level of assurance, in the real world, not on the blockchain. You don’t know what the word fungible means.

The first sentence isn't true. That's kind of the whole point. Bitcoin can be spent without permission. The mechanism you are talking about is a social mechanism that can be applied to anything. Yes, even monero. If Monero had an exchange your coins could be frozen there too. If you KYCd your monero, everytime you spent that amount somewhere and your name was involved you would get flagged. The problem is not the protocol it is the idea that people are using a social debt network (money) while being a social pariah. You can use bitcoin privately, or not. You must use monero privately. That in and of itself is something we have never seen as a species. Fungibility though IS not inherent to the protocol that is a network/social layer ontop of the mechanism of money.

I’ve never taken a dollar bill anywhere in America and been told I can’t use it because it had cocaine on it. Hard currency is obviously fungible. II do not care about privacy. At all. It doesn’t mater to me. Only fungibility at spending time. Ring signatures offer a contract of fungibility. Monero has been fungible for me, and I’m the most banned guy you’ve ever talked to. I do not care whatever theoretical vision you have in your head of things being private or fungible or whatever. Using Bitcoin gets my commerce fucked up. Using Monero does not. It is that simple.

Dollar bills are refused all the time because of who is spending them not cocaine or whatever. Banks refuse customers who don't have ID, or are on blacklists (I'm sure you know) so unless you are physically in a place to spend that dollar, your dollar isn't fungible. I don't see a scenario where you have bitcoin, spend it from an address and someone somehow stops you. Maybe the vendor doesn't like you but that's how commerce works. I sell guns and bombs to people I like, not those I don't. Monero makes it so I have to sell my dangerous shit to people I don't know.

> Banks refuse customers who don't have ID, That’s not making the bill not fungible. That just means the bank requires customer ID. The $20 I wanted to deposit in the bank (with no ID?) still is fungible. Do you understand what fungible means?

Dude,what do you think the term "marked bills" means? how do you spend dollars, physically in person? So your ability to spend physical dollars is dependent on if you can physically get to the place you're spending them. Also as I said, no matter the dollar if YOU are spending them, it is tainted by the gayfeds. Just for reference, that is not how most people spend dollars and is literally impossible in a lot of places. Apply this to Bitcoin just a chain of signatures. Nothing about the signature has any identification whatsoever. I can spend bitcoin from anywhere, with no restriction. The fungibility of bitcoin (or literally anything else) is an out of band designation that uses pointers to facts about the item: Serial numbers, outputs, even entire types of money. Fungibility is not a property of money as some people love to say. It is a social enforcement mechanism that is revoked at the moment you are a pariah.

Okay well, I’ve never had a problem spending or receiving Monero or a stack of benjamins. I’ve had a host of problems spending and receiving Bitcoin. That’s been my experience. I want Bitcoin to also have the same thing that makes Monero great! I want Bitcoin to have on-chain fungibility! Right now you only get that off chain via BOLT12, and ain’t nobody supporting that. I am using another currency only because Bitcoin Core has failed to make Bitcoin useful money for me. I’d *rather use Bitcoin*. I want Bitcoin to be useful money! But they are intent on making it a “store of value” and something to enable more NFTs and memecoins. That ship has already sailed to Solana probably irrevocably. Tether started on Bitcoin but SOL and TRX became the largest beneficiaries of it. One after another, every real world use of blockchains has gone to things that are not Bitcoin. I would like Bitcoin to at least be useful money, but they are intent on doing some weird lending scheme shit and “management token” with Citrea instead. People want to use cryptocurrency! But they don’t want to use Bitcoin anymore. I have come to the conclusion that this is because Core is institutionally captured, and institutional authorities do not want competition to the monetary system.

Hey, I feel that too. People are working on alternate governance systems: Bitcoin common BLVM, Bitcoin Echo, and HonetNode consensus spec. All take the power out of core (and forks or core) and make it non-monolithic readable and forkable. I think Monero is cool, the cypherpunk in me loves it, the economist in me doesn't. I don't know how to get around that.

"The Bitcoin President is bad but we're going to make a Bitcoin Counsel of Alderman" NO. People have to more aggressively make demands of Core! Or you're just another Knots! No forking! People need to make them fulfill Satoshi's vision! Bitcoin was supposed to be a fucking monetary system!

Lol, I would encourage you to look into the ones that I named. It's nothing like that, but that's hilarious. It modularizes the Bitcoin code into six different chunks and the only configurable chunks are the implementations put on top and pretty much anybody can write those 20 to 30,000 lines of code. "Governance" in this context is who writes the simple user interface and node policy. Consensus is never touched.