They totally fucked up. No question. Regarding my attitude: it doesn't take hero worship to recognize what I've learned from them and actually I think that since I never thought they were heroes, I don't actually feel particularly betrayed. I just think they're human and they fucked up. The dishonesty in your post is that Odell recommended dice rolls for years, watched as people didn't do enough rolls and lost their stack, and then started recommending against it. Was he right to do that? Nope. But did he start off telling people not to create their own entropy or did he discourage it for nefarious reasons? No. Pushing this clip without that context feels really shitty to me.