I believe you did those things, but have viruses been shown to exist using the scientific method without using cell cultures? I can't find a single study or paper that proves that most foundational fact
This quote from Dr. Jordan Grant sums up my issues pretty well:
"I can promise you all right now: you will not find a SINGLE paper in the history of virology which has found the 'thing' inside a human being (or animal), taken that THING as the independent variable in a legitimate experiment, and proven it CAUSES the disease being studied.
That is what is necessary.
When we ask for this, and they give us the cell culture question begging nonsense, you realize it quickly that they have nothing, otherwise they'd be giving us the true scientific papers. It should be easy, if they're there...and they're not.
They do not get off the hook by begging the question. Meaning, they say "virus" as if this entity was ever PROVEN to exist, yet they cannot give you any original papers where such a thing was done.
INSTEAD, they simply PRESUPPOSE (beg the question) that this entity is real, and then engage in their cell culture nonsense and claim the EFFECT they see is "proof of the virus".
This is a logical fallacy. It is affirming the consequent, only worse, because their antecedent hasn't even been shown to EXIST.
For example, if I said "if it rains, my car will be wet. My car is wet, therefore it rained" - this would be a logical fallacy. But the "rain" is known to at least EXIST.
With viruses, it's simply "if my fairy tale belief is true, we will see XYZ in a cell culture. we DO see XYZ, therefore my fairy tale belief is true".
It's the worst form of affirming the consequent because it also incorporates unproven premises.
This is the STANDARD for virology.
once you get this, you can dissect any paper.
IF they claim "we know the virus is there because of the CPE", ask them which paper ever proved that a virus caused CPE, and where "virus" was proven in the first place. You don't get to claim an EFFECT is proof of anything without the antecedent"
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So you have an alternative explanation for the VAST body of knowledge built on virus theory?
What would be acceptable evidence for you?
I left out a bunch because my note was long AF.
When we transfected cells and could see editing via next gen sequencing, we had controls. If we 'transfected' with just buffer (no AAV vector) or if we transfected with purified empty capsids (no payload) or if we transfected with a non-functional 'dummy' payload we got no editing. So we controlled for some spontaneous process occurring in the cells to give us our results - it turns out we required intact capsids with the correct engineered payload to see function that we could measure.
For your car analogy, did you also park your car under a carport roof or next to a sprinkler on a sunny day to explore other ways a car could get wet or stay dry?
An AAV virus is on the order of 25 nm in size, so hard to study. Like many things at this scale, we must be creative and attempt to form hypotheses and devise experiments to test them.
If I had access to a BSL4 lab and a supply of monkeys recently deceased from ebola and I handed you a teaspoon full of their bodily fluids that I had subjected to techniques used to purify/enrich for viral particles, would you consume it if I offered you 1 BTC to do so?
[ spoiler: I would not let you because I care about your well being! ]
Humans may think we are pretty smart monkeys, but there are innumerable things in our universe that we do not understand or even know about. I find being comfortable with this more fun that constraining what I am willing to ponder based on an evolving framework.
Its worth taking a look at the terrain theory of disease. All "disease" is caused by toxicity or deficiency.
Toxicity could be heavy metal overload, unclean water, pesticides/herbicide exposure, pfas, harmful radiation/nnemf, etc
Proof of transmission of viruses has never been done. Just look at the tests during the Spanish flu by Dr Rosenau that showed fluid swapping from sick to healthy patients didn't produce disease
The foundations for virology, and thus the entire field of virology, is pseudoscientific.
Pseudoscience is anything claiming to be scientific that doesn’t follow the scientific method. In every single "viral isolation" paper — which is the foundational evidence for the field of virology (of which all other pieces of virology and also the field of vaccinology are built upon), a variation of this procedure is followed:
snot/blood/other fluids from a sick person assumed to contain virus particles (but never verified to contain virus particles) is added to viral transport medium (VTM). At a minimum VTM contains fetal bovine serum (FBS), amphotericin B (a nephrotoxic antimycotic) and gentamicin (a nephrotoxic antibiotic). Nephrotoxic means “toxic to kidneys”, by the way. That’ll come in next.
After this, they take that mixture (a sample of snot/blood/other fluids and VTM) and add it to a foreign cell line that has been kept alive via unnatural means in a lab, typically VERO E6, VERO CCL81 (kidney cells from an adult green monkey) or human embryonic kidney (HEK) cells.
Then, after that mixture is added to the cells (or sometimes alongside adding the mixture or just before adding the mixture) the nutrient serum for the cells, FBS, is reduced from 10% to 2% (and sometimes to 1% or 0%), effectively starving the cells of their food. They also add gentamicin (sometimes geneticin) and amphotericin B to the culture. Again, these substances are known to be nephrotoxic (toxic to kidneys), and they're being added to kidney cells, where it's assumed they have no negative effects on the cells and are simply there to keep the environment free of fungal and bacterial growth.
The cells then break down, experiencing what is called the cytopathic effect (CPE), which is cell injury or death. The sample is then prepared for electron microscopy, (which is another MAJOR problem in and of itself where many of the resultant particles are claimed be viruses)
https://rumble.com/v674tqy-e141-reframing-the-infectious...
This process is pseudoscientific (and absurd) for the following reasons:
The scientific method requires an observed natural phenomenon. Full stop. That menas you observe something happening in nature. The moment you take something out of its natural context, it's no longer an observed natural phenomenon (this is especially the case when excising tissue from a complex physical, chemical, emotional, electric, etc. entity, throwing a bunch of shit on it in a lab and assuming it tells you something about natural world is absurd).
However, in the case of so-called "infectious diseases", you might say that you observe two or more people getting sick in the same space with similar symptoms. In my mind, that is a justified observed natural phenomenon. After that, you form a hypothesis. For example, “I think Y phenomenon (dependent variable) is caused by X particle (independent variable)."
In order to proceed to test that hypothesis, you need to have X, the presumed cause, the thing you think causes Y, in order to vary and manipulate it to see if it produces the observed effect in question. That is arguably the most important step. In order to follow the scientific method, you need your independent variable, X. Virology has NEVER shown that "X" exists.
Contagion is a myth, and the only virus is in our minds. The cognitive dissonance when I heard this the first time was strong. But but, I've been taught my whole life to fear these things that are out to get me. Its been liberating to know its nonsense.
Believe whatever you want, just felt it was important to lay this out for others to look into with a discerning mind. Lots of resources on the subject if there's a desire to look..
I wish anyone who read this far health, wealth and wisdom. Be well
Pls look at my response to Hanshan. I'm not trying to debate, just wanted to offer an example to Hodl's original idea. Please do look up the Rosenau experiments from the "Spanish flu"- that was quite enlightening for me.
Funny enough I haven't been "sick" since I stopped believing in viruses and germ theory years ago
Everyone is free to believe what they want