And another strange NIP-42 behavior. inbox.nostr.wine says "auth_required" in NIP-11 but when you connect it dose not send an AUTH challenge until the client tries to publish or read So noStrudel is in a staring contest with the relay because I don't want it to send a REQ until authenticated but the relay wont send the challenge

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easier said then done. am I supposed to make the client send an empty REQ for every connect just to ask if I could please get the auth challenge
But NIP-11 says auth_required: this relay requires NIP-42 authentication to happen before a new connection may perform any other action. Even if set to False, authentication may be required for specific actions. *any other action* - so to support relays that have auth_required=true and don't immediately send the challenge I would have to basically ignore the auth_required field...
That seems like an error in NIP-11. I have seen relays send AUTH at a lot of different times. Sometimes only certain actions are gated behind auth (like requesting content from a closed NIP-29 group).